BaySentry PCN/NTK received - Do I have to pay? How to appeal?

Spondulics

Hi,

The car I am a keeper of was parked in a private multi storey car park in Watford (Sutton Car Park) on 23/11/24 run by BaySentry Solutions. Parking was paid for at a machine. The parking was in a disabled space and had a badge on display. An NTK / PCN was received by me as the keeper on 9/12/24 but the date of issue was 2/12/24. Upon receiving the driver checked their statements and noticed the payment didn't go through, even though they used the payment machine and tapped their card. Apparently there was no button to press for a receipt and no barrier to exit the card park that would have prevented exit without paying, although the driver in good faith thought payment had been made. The setup of the car park like this almost seems designed to scam drivers, being different to the main shopping centres car parks in Watford which have ANPR but barriers also. 

The PCN notes the contravention is "Parked with no valid parking session/electronic permit"
The PCN does not mention the car park name, just a street name.
The only images for of the rear of the car showing the number plate on entry and exit. Unsure of there is any CCTV.

So, I have read the newbies thread, there is so much information it is hard to take in. As the driver tried to pay but did not actually pay are there any grounds for appeal? The NTK mentions para 8(2)b of schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) and also BaySentry are an approved BPA Operator Operating in accordance with the British Parking Association's Code of Practice. I take this to mean that they have 14 days for the NTK to arrive with the keeper but it did not. However, POFA notes that this can be assumed as 2 days after the date of issue, which did not happen, but therefore does this mean the 14 day appeal / invalidity does not hold water as this would have been 4/12 so within 14 days?
Note there was no ticket on the windscreen issued on the day, only the PCN/NTK received.

Are there any other grounds for appeal?

I undertand I can appeal to BaySentry, then to POPLA then it could go to court.
Should I use the template to appeal to BaySentry in the first instance? (as keeper)
Should I or the driver revisit the car park to take images of any signs for evidence?
Does the 14 days for discounted payment begin from the issue date, issue date +2 days or day I received the PCN/NTK?

So far I have done nothing and although it is a car park for retail being near the town centre it is not for a specific shop so I do not know who the landlord is to complain to them as suggested to be Plan A in the newbie thread. Some searching suggests it is run by CitiPark and operated under a lease from Watford Borough Council, although it is going to be redeveloped soon. If it is council owned, how can it be "private land"?
It is running at only 30% capacity on average which might explain the PCNs to increase revenue.
Council 

Refs:
www.watfordobserver.co.uk/news/24741005.town-centres-citipark-sutton-to-sold-redevelopment/
www.watfordobserver.co.uk/news/24752955.sutton-road-car-park-sale-agreed-council-cabinet-meeting/
watford.moderngov.co.uk/documents/s48539/Sutton%20Car%20Park.pdf
watford.moderngov.co.uk/mgIssueHistoryHome.aspx?IId=31207
citipark.co.uk/car-parks/watford/sutton-car-park
www.watford.gov.uk/directory-record/36/sutton

Should I be complaining to my or Watford's MP about this or the council?

I simply cannot afford to pay for tickets whereby a customer used a car park in good faith, paid, or attempted and thought they did, and then get this PCN.

Thanks for any help and advise received. I can upload a redacted PCN/NTK if it would help.

Apologies if this is a bit waffly but it indicates how fries my brain is after trying to research into this topic.

Coupon-mad

No need to show us the NTK because the NEWBIES thread already shows you a link to s whole thread of pictures including Bay Sentry.

it is a car park for retail being near the town centre it is not for a specific shop so I do not know who the landlord is to complain to them as suggested to be Plan A in the newbie thread. Some searching suggests it is run by CitiPark and operated under a lease from Watford Borough Council, although it is going to be redeveloped soon.

What name appears at the entrance to the retail park (not the Bay Sentry sign, the other one)?

Spondulics

Hi @Coupon-mad, thanks for the response. The retail centre is called Atria Watford but this car park is the other side of the ring road so I don't think it's part of it.

Coupon-mad

I'd just ignore Bay Sentry then, if you cannot find the landowner to complain to.

SuzieJJ

Hi All

I received the same fine from BaySentry for the church car park on the same day as spondulics above. I paid for my car park and didn't get a receipt but my bank statement shows it was paid. I then got stuck in the car park that day for 1.5 hours due to a traffic accident along with 3/4 levels of cars at a standstill.
I emailed Baysentry when I received the fine to dispute it and then I appealed online.  I didn't hear back from them so I emailed them 3 days after and they then responded 3 days later and said that no appeal went through and that I now cannot appeal because the time has lapsed.

I sent several emails explaining that i did initially appeal, I sent proof that I paid through bank statement (redacted) then christmas came along and I kept emailing them and they said I need to pay the £100 fine. 
I have kept emailing them to look into this, they sent links to the complaints online of which all of the links came up with error page and I screen shot these and sent them this back.
I have been polite but disgruntled and now they have sent it to the debt collector with a fine to pay for £170. The letter also states they can come and take my car away!

Does anyone have any advice as I fear now that I will have to pay as I do not want to go to court? Or have a ccj as the only thing I cannot prove is that I did appeal, as it seems they didn't receive it.

Coupon-mad

Sit tight. Do nothing except the below.

By going confidently into the 'ignore' stance, the only steps to take (because you MUST check every letter) are:

- Tell them if you move house within 6 years.

- Ignore the tedious £170 threatograms shown in pictures in the 4th post of the NEWBIES thread.

- Come back if you get a solicitor's LBC as per the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread.

Nobody pays a penny and no hearing is even needed in most cases. Search the forum and read a few cases as they are easy to beat by waiting for a claim form - it is easier than appealing!

There is no risk AT ALL in defending a court claim. No CCJ. No bailiffs.