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Outside light problem

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I have 5 outside lights of the same design, and two are not working.  Opened one up thinking it would just need a bulb replacement, but no, looks far more complicated.  I’ve attached images, am I simply going to have to change the complete light to get it working, or is there a simple fix?



Thanks

Comments

  • vacheron
    vacheron Posts: 2,185 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 26 November 2024 at 3:11PM
    That is an array of white LED's on a PCB. They will be connected in an array of series and parralel chains.

    The ones that appear darker are because the phosphor coating on the LED has degraded, either due to overheating, moisture ingress, age, or a combination of the three. It is most likely these are the cause of the problem. 

    It can be debugged and repaired, but it is not a simple nor cheap task and will require specialist measurement meters and soldering tools.

    Is the whole light not illuminating, or just some of the LEDs?
    • The rich buy assets.
    • The poor only have expenses.
    • The middle class buy liabilities they think are assets.
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  • dharm999
    dharm999 Posts: 692 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper
    it’s some of the leds in one light and all in another one.  I suspect it’s going to be cheaper to replace both lights rather than repair
  • ThisIsWeird
    ThisIsWeird Posts: 7,935 Forumite
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    edited 26 November 2024 at 3:37PM
    Assuming the DC power supply is still working, and you have a meter to test its output, there is potential there for wiring it directly to a different LED array. That is assuming that there IS a DC adaptor built in?
    Do NOT assume there isn't a high voltage present on these LEDs, just 'cos they are LEDs! If a group are arranged in series, them ~2V jobbies will soon add up to an 'ouch'.
    You'd reuse that PCB to mount the new LED(s) to, and wire it directly to the brown and blue wires - after first checking that these are not 'live'.
    How DIYish are you? Could you remove one light and disassemble it fully? Almost certainly you'll be able to buy a smaller LED cluster that 'should' work.
    But, first - what voltage is being supplied to that board, and is it DC?
  • dharm999
    dharm999 Posts: 692 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper
    Power is still working as some of the leds still work. How would I know if it’s DC?  I assume if I take the light apart somewhere within it, I should see something that tells me the voltage?

    Do the individual leds come out the PCB if pulled, or are they soldered in place?  If they come out, can I simply buy new ones to replace the non working ones?  Or do I need to wire in a whole new PCB with soldered on LEDs?
  • FreeBear
    FreeBear Posts: 18,231 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    dharm999 said: Do the individual leds come out the PCB if pulled, or are they soldered in place?  If they come out, can I simply buy new ones to replace the non working ones?  Or do I need to wire in a whole new PCB with soldered on LEDs?
    The LEDs are soldered in to place. There may be a blob of glue as well. To unsolder and resolder new ones in place requires specialist equipment (ideally, a hot air gun designed for soldering and a hot plate). You also need to identify the make/model/manufacturer of the LED and obtain the correct replacement - Not all LEDs are the same. These things are not designed to be repairable by the average homeowner.
    Easier to just buy a replacement fitting.

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  • vacheron
    vacheron Posts: 2,185 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 26 November 2024 at 4:18PM
    Assuming the DC power supply is still working, and you have a meter to test its output, there is potential there for wiring it directly to a different LED array. That is assuming that there IS a DC adaptor built in?
    Do NOT assume there isn't a high voltage present on these LEDs, just 'cos they are LEDs! If a group are arranged in series, them ~2V jobbies will soon add up to an 'ouch'.
    You'd reuse that PCB to mount the new LED(s) to, and wire it directly to the brown and blue wires - after first checking that these are not 'live'.
    How DIYish are you? Could you remove one light and disassemble it fully? Almost certainly you'll be able to buy a smaller LED cluster that 'should' work.
    But, first - what voltage is being supplied to that board, and is it DC?
    My first concern looking at the board was the lack of any current limiting components and the brown / blue wires which suggests that the LED board may be being fed directly from 230V AC. This is an awful (but extremely cheap) way to drive LEDs and if so I'm not surprised the LEDs have packed in!

    If an LED fails short circuit you can end up with a cascade failure that will kill all the other LEDs. If an LED fails open circuit, you will lose a large amout of LEDs at once (especially if they "are" being driven at 230V). 

    Also unless the frame is double insulated, it is also an extremely dangerous way to drive LEDs!

    I'm assuming (hoping) that there is a constant current DC driver in that lower black base, and they have just used blue-brown cable for BOM cost savings!
    • The rich buy assets.
    • The poor only have expenses.
    • The middle class buy liabilities they think are assets.
    Robert T. Kiyosaki
  • Mr.Generous
    Mr.Generous Posts: 3,971 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    Despite the claims of long life I much prefer fittings with a replacable lamp. You can stick an LED bulb in and save energy without having to chuck the thing away every few years.
    Mr Generous - Landlord for more than 10 years. Generous? - Possibly but sarcastic more likely.
  • ThisIsWeird
    ThisIsWeird Posts: 7,935 Forumite
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    edited 27 November 2024 at 8:02AM
    dharm999 said:
    Power is still working as some of the leds still work. How would I know if it’s DC?  I assume if I take the light apart somewhere within it, I should see something that tells me the voltage?

    Do the individual leds come out the PCB if pulled, or are they soldered in place?  If they come out, can I simply buy new ones to replace the non working ones?  Or do I need to wire in a whole new PCB with soldered on LEDs?
    Do you have a multimeter? A soldering iron?
    How bright are these lights - do they light up a path, or just provide mood/decorative lighting?
    Anyhoo, you'll only know if you can 'fix' it if you remove one fully and disassemble it. 
    I had a much larger outside light which went kaput, with the LEDs flickering wildly. It had two LED cluster strips inside, and an acdc transformer. There was plenty of room to fit a couple of ses holders, back to back, and a couple of 'candle' LED bulbs. Yours looks far too tight for that solution, unless a small wattage lamp could do, like those you fit in cooker hoods?
    But forget trying to repair the existing clusters - not realistic for yer average DIYer. But quite possibly a replacement cluster option is available.
    But, readings required.

    Various sizes and wattages, around £1 a piece (sold in 10's); https://a.aliexpress.com/_EIGonzT

  • dharm999
    dharm999 Posts: 692 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper
    Thanks, think the best option for me is to replace with something else.  There are 4 others, of the same type, and one isn’t working at all, and two are flickering, so only a matter of time before they go.  They aren’t what we would have chosen ourselves, so it’s an opportune time to change them.
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