Help with Witness Statement/ evidence

Coupon-mad

Eggyman95 said:

I have asked the residents to see what they can find. They have long since moved out but are looking for an old email. 

What does this mean for my defence? Is there one?

Definitely!  Easy one.

 "I was collecting friends from their flat".

Search the forum for this, and copy:

Defence definition parking period setting down passengers

Eggyman95

Coupon-mad said:

Eggyman95 said:

I have asked the residents to see what they can find. They have long since moved out but are looking for an old email. 

What does this mean for my defence? Is there one?

Definitely!  Easy one.

 "I was collecting friends from their flat".

Search the forum for this, and copy:

Defence definition parking period setting down passengers

Thank you so much. 

I do somewhat struggle to navigate the forums on here, but the information is invaluable and full of amazing, selfless people. 

Just needed some direction as to what to search. 

I will draft my defence based on the help given and post when finished 

Eggyman95

Hi all, please see my draft defence below. 

3. The Defendant’s was stationary in their vehicle xxx xxx at Station Road car park for 14 minutes and 12 seconds on 14/07/2021 to collect the (then) residents of Flat x, xx Station Road, xxx xxx. This car park had long been associated with the flat at the above address, pre-dating Euro Car Park’s involvement with the site. The Defendant had frequented this site many times in the past for the purpose of visiting/ picking up the above residents. During this time, the car park was free to park in and visitors to the associated flats able to park there. 

4. The Defendant was unaware of any changes to visitor parking rules as the car park had only recently changed hands. The British Parking Association code of conduct rule 18:11 - Where there is any change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you should make these clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you should consider a grace period to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes.

5. In Laura Jopson vs Homeguard Securities case number B9GF0A9E, His Honour Judge J Harris QC the judge states "getting in or out of it, loading or unloading it, and perhaps coping with some vicissitude of short duration" is not parking. This was an appeal court case and thus persuasive on the lower courts. The court transcript of that hearing and judgment, heard on appeal by HHJ Harris sitting at Oxford Court, will be provided at witness statement stage in support of this defence. 

Few questions I have. 

Should I provide more context on para 5 to my case or leave it as it is. 

Should I break up para 3 into my two points of defence and address them separately? So start with rules change and link rule 18:11 and then address the picking up/ setting down. 

Le_Kirk

Eggyman95 said:

3. The Defendant’s was stationary in their vehicle xxx xxx at Station Road car park for 14 minutes and 12 seconds on 14/07/2021 to collect the (then) residents of Flat x, xx Station Road..... 

Some confusion here; did you mean the defendant's car or did you mean defendant?

Eggyman95

Le_Kirk said:

Eggyman95 said:

3. The Defendant’s was stationary in their vehicle xxx xxx at Station Road car park for 14 minutes and 12 seconds on 14/07/2021 to collect the (then) residents of Flat x, xx Station Road..... 

Some confusion here; did you mean the defendant's car or did you mean defendant?

Whoops.
i meant either really. I was reluctant to use ‘parked’ as later I use the defence “getting in or out of it, loading or unloading it, and perhaps coping with some vicissitude of short duration" is not parking. 

Coupon-mad

I don't think this is from the BPA CoP from the date of your parking event:

"The British Parking Association code of conduct rule 18:11 - Where there is any change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you should make these clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you should consider a grace period to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes."

The wording was stronger in the 2020 CoP and required extra signs to alert people (not just the wishy-washy 'you should consider'!).

I'm disappointed that you didn't do (or didn't read enough results from) the keyword search I handed to you above in bold, which would have given exactly you what you need to quote from the DLUHC.

Eggyman95

Coupon-mad said:

I don't think this is from the BPA CoP from the date of your parking event:

"The British Parking Association code of conduct rule 18:11 - Where there is any change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you should make these clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you should consider a grace period to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes."

The wording was stronger in the 2020 CoP and required extra signs to alert people (not just the wishy-washy 'you should consider'!).

I'm disappointed that you didn't do (or didn't read enough results from) the keyword search I handed to you above in bold, which would have given exactly you what you need to quote from the DLUHC.

I had read through maybe 4/5 but wasn’t sure which were relevant so ended up quoting the court case. I’ve since read through more. Did you mean this text? : 

1  The Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities ('DLUHC') published in February 2022, a Private Parking Code of Practice includes the following two points which highlight that dropping a passenger or picking them up is not considered parking:

2.19 parked/parking

an instance of a vehicle being caused by the driver to remain stationary other than in the course of driving (excluding instances where the driver has stopped to enable passengers leave or enter the vehicle)

A vehicle may be deemed to be parked whether or not the driver has left the vehicle or turned off the ignition

2.24 parking period

the length of time that a vehicle has been parked, i.e. left stationary otherwise than in the course of driving, after any relevant consideration period has expired (excluding instances where the driver has stopped to enable passengers to leave or enter the vehicle)

I’ll also try and find updated wording from the 2020 CoP. Is it best to quote the 2020 over the 2024 as it was the time of parking?

Eggyman95

The BPA CoP states:

19.10 Where there is a change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you must make these terms and conditions clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you must consider a transition to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes. Best practice would be the installation of additional/ temporary signage at the entrance and throughout the site making it clear that new terms and conditions apply. This will ensure such that regular visitors who may be familiar with the previous terms become aware of the new ones.

Coupon-mad

Eggyman95 said:

The BPA CoP states:

19.10 Where there is a change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you must make these terms and conditions clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you must consider a transition to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes. Best practice would be the installation of additional/ temporary signage at the entrance and throughout the site making it clear that new terms and conditions apply. This will ensure such that regular visitors who may be familiar with the previous terms become aware of the new ones.

 But isn't that from the new (joke) 1st October 'joint CoP' which is irrelevant for your case?

Re the other bit - YES that is it.

Eggyman95

Coupon-mad said:

Eggyman95 said:

The BPA CoP states:

19.10 Where there is a change in the terms and conditions that materially affects the motorist then you must make these terms and conditions clear on your signage. Where such changes impose liability where none previously existed then you must consider a transition to allow regular visitors to the site to adjust and familiarise themselves with the changes. Best practice would be the installation of additional/ temporary signage at the entrance and throughout the site making it clear that new terms and conditions apply. This will ensure such that regular visitors who may be familiar with the previous terms become aware of the new ones.

 But isn't that from the new (joke) 1st October 'joint CoP' which is irrelevant for your case?

Re the other bit - YES that is it.

Thank you re the information. This is from the 2020 CoP, not the 2024