Query over insurance money paid into a joint account

SS0827

Hi Very sadly my partner recently passed away from cancer . Before he died he cashed in one of his pension funds under critical health. He completed the forms sent by the company and these were returned and received on the 2nd September by the company  Very sadly he passed away suddenly on the 5th September . The money was received into our joint account after he passed. Just to note that he had told he’s solicitor that the money was intended for me so I could have security after he passed.  I’ve had lots of conflicting advice from the probate solicitor basically although his wishes and intentions were extremely clear they are now requesting that I return the money as it was paid after death ( although in process whilst he was alive) as they now state it forms part of the estate.  Could anyone help with advice as I’m not sure where I stand?  Thank you 

Keep_pedalling

Sorry you find yourself in this mess.

Before he did this who had he nominated as his beneficiary with the pension company? Was this an old fashioned defined benefits type pension?

Are you the main beneficiary of his will?

sheslookinhot

Have your partner’s solicitor communicate with probate solicitor that his actions were sound and no money will be returned.

mattojgb

If you were the nominee to receive any death benefits from the pension, then I see no reason why they wouldn't be yours.

Bit more complex if you weren't the nominee, but I imagine as the account would have become a sole account on death of your partner, then the money was never part of the estate. There may be a question over whether the pension co. could seek return of the funds on the basis they were paid to the wrong person, and the executor might have a claim against the pension co.

msb1234

I would think that technically the money should not have been paid into what was then your own account, as the status of it as a joint account would have ceased upon his death. 

Did he have a will, and if so, were you the sole beneficiary?

elsien

msb1234 said:

I would think that technically the money should not have been paid into what was then your own account, as the status of it as a joint account would have ceased upon his death. 

Did he have a will, and if so, were you the sole beneficiary?

 The money was paid into the account before he died. 

Marcon

S0827 said:

Hi Very sadly my partner recently passed away from cancer . Before he died he cashed in one of his pension funds under critical health. He completed the forms sent by the company and these were returned and received on the 2nd September by the company  Very sadly he passed away suddenly on the 5th September . The money was received into our joint account after he passed. Just to note that he had told he’s solicitor that the money was intended for me so I could have security after he passed.  I’ve had lots of conflicting advice from the probate solicitor basically although his wishes and intentions were extremely clear they are now requesting that I return the money as it was paid after death ( although in process whilst he was alive) as they now state it forms part of the estate.  Could anyone help with advice as I’m not sure where I stand?  Thank you 

I'm sorry you are having to cope with this as well as the death of your partner.

If you were married, in tax terms it makes little difference - and the word 'partner' can sometimes be used to mean 'spouse'.

If you weren't married, this could be important. You need to clarify if this was a defined benefit (aka final salary or sometimes CARE) scheme, or a defined contribution (DC) scheme - some sort of personal pension, SIPP, or a DC workplace pension.

From your post, and the reference to this pension being with an insurer, it sounds likely that it was a DC pension. It doesn't make sense to say that the pension money forms part of your partner's estate, and therefore needs to be returned, simply because it was paid after death. Either the probate solicitor is confused, or your grief and distress mean you aren't quite following what they are saying, or a bit of both.

Whichever it is, returning the money promptly could be a good idea if your partner's estate is large enough to be subject to IHT and you are the nominated beneficiary. That's because any 'unspent' pension money in his estate - and he clearly had no time to actually spend it - would be subject to IHT, whereas if the money is  returned to the pension provider and then paid to you at the discretion of the pension provider, no IHT is payable (and there is no income tax if your partner was under 75 when they died). Maybe check that with your solicitor and you can then be comfortable everyone is thinking on the same lines?

sheslookinhot said:

Have your partner’s solicitor communicate with probate solicitor that his actions were sound and no money will be returned.

Often a very good way to proceed, but it's not the issue here.

HillStreetBlues

elsien said:

msb1234 said:

I would think that technically the money should not have been paid into what was then your own account, as the status of it as a joint account would have ceased upon his death. 

Did he have a will, and if so, were you the sole beneficiary?

 The money was paid into the account before he died. 

SS0827 said:

Hi Very sadly my partner recently passed away from cancer . Before he died he cashed in one of his pension funds under critical health. He completed the forms sent by the company and these were returned and received on the 2nd September by the company  Very sadly he passed away suddenly on the 5th September . The money was received into our joint account after he passed. Just to note that he had told he’s solicitor that the money was intended for me so I could have security after he passed.  I’ve had lots of conflicting advice from the probate solicitor basically although his wishes and intentions were extremely clear they are now requesting that I return the money as it was paid after death ( although in process whilst he was alive) as they now state it forms part of the estate.  Could anyone help with advice as I’m not sure where I stand?  Thank you 

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msb1234

elsien said:

msb1234 said:

I would think that technically the money should not have been paid into what was then your own account, as the status of it as a joint account would have ceased upon his death. 

Did he have a will, and if so, were you the sole beneficiary?

 The money was paid into the account before he died. 

No, she said it was paid AFTER he died.