Civil Service Pension - Refusal to pay pension in line with their own quotation

Bravepants

Dealing with MyCSP is slow at best, and glacial at worst!

xylophone

That's one hell of a rounding error!

I still can't quite work out what is going on.

Does the OP mean that the original quotation was for

eg £10,000 per annum ?

He pointed out that it was far too low and eventually he received and accepted a quote for

eg £12,095 per annum?

Therefore he was expecting a gross payment of approx £1008  per month?

In fact he is receiving a gross payment of  only £608 a month?

Emerit

Thankfully, ill health didn't trigger my early retirement as per the article in the link (CRANE-CASE) above.
Sadly, there are potentially lots of people that have too much faith in pension administrators being diligent and are losing out because of it.  I hope it's not a computer programme glitch!

Pat38493

Emerit said:

Thankfully, ill health didn't trigger my early retirement as per the article in the link (CRANE-CASE) above.
Sadly, there are potentially lots of people that have too much faith in pension administrators being diligent and are losing out because of it.  I hope it's not a computer programme glitch!

What is the magnitude of the differences here?  Is it worth all the hassle?

I tried to strike up an argument with Mercer a while back (there is a thread about it here) on a similar topic where I had tried to manually calculate my DB benefits according to their "factsheet" for my deferred private company DB pension.

Unfortunately it's very difficult because each question takes several weeks to turn around, and they usually answer the question in a way which is quite hard to match back to what you were originally trying to figure out.

FWIW - the question there was around how they were applying inflation increases, and to what extend the exact retirement date would impact on the application of the statutory DB pension uplift requirements from the government. I was contending that because I was putting the benefits into payment after the anniversary date of the deferral, I should get an extra year of statutory uplift.  Their replies were not easy to understand but they seemed to be saying that this it no applicable because they are calculating your benefits at NRA using estimated inflation to the future, and then applying the reduction from the NRA .  DB expert here said that this is not what "usually" happens, but it's hard to argue with them unless you can show it's actually not compliant with some law.

In the end I just had to assume that if the quote and result is within the same ballpark as my manual estimate it is ok - certainly not ideal with such a huge "asset".

Unfortunately when it comes to early retirement they always have the get out of jail card - we changed the ERF without telling anybody, which they are allowed to do.

Marcon

FIREDreamer said:

Marcon said:

Emerit said:

Thank you for the comments.  Clarifications and a little more detail as follows:
In October 2023, MyCSP (My Civil Service Pension) was notified of my intention to retire in January 2024 - 4 mths notice normally required so I expected a delay in the pension being paid - fair enough?
1st quotation received 28 Dec 2023 - way off the mark; I sent it back to MyCSP pointing out their error.
2nd quotation received Jan 24- I accepted the quotation
3rd quotation received in March - MyCSP told me there was an error in their calculation.  I accepted the quotation.  

Payments commenced in April 24 - less that was stipulated in any of the quotations.
Following many e-mails and telephone calls, the first 'formal' complaint sent to Scheme Administrator 01 May 24.
21 May, MyCSP issue Pension Finalisation Statement (values as per their 3rd Quotation) but no explanation why actual payments fell short.
Internal Dispute Resolution (IDR) procedure - Stage 1 complaint sent 22 May because no reason for shortfall in payments was provided in the Scheme Administrators response on 21 May
18 June. Response from MyCSP confirmed that payments were less than they should be.  Quotations from the response:
1) 'which appears to be the result of an administrative oversight when finalising your retirement benefits' and
2) '....I [complaint manager] have escalated this matter with the team again in order to expedite a resolution for you...'
At this point I thought the matter was resolved
July and August - more e-mails and phone calls but shortfall in pension payment not resolved. 

Complaint to Scheme Manager (Cabinet Office) under stage 2 of the complaints procedure - sent e-mail on 9 Sep because shortfall in payment not addressed.

9 October response from MyCSP stating how they calculated the inflation increase for the current financial year.  But the inflation adjusted value is less than the value quoted in the quotation and finalisation statement.  No explanation why this is the case.

Complaint to Scheme Manager (Cabinet Office) under stage 2 of the complaints procedure - sent e-mail on 9 Oct asking MyCSP to explain why the inflation adjusted pension is less that the value in the quotation.  Auto acknowledged but no response to date (14 Nov 24).

10 October  - Complaint Form and supporting information sent to Pensions Ombudsman.  Acknowledgement stated that a response should be due in 20 days.  Having checked, the Ombudsman's automated message on their phone line says they're running late due to the volume of complaints. 

Complaint to Scheme Manager (Cabinet Office) under stage 2 of the complaints procedure - sent via on-line MyCSP form on 12 Nov 24 requesting an explanation why shortfall has not been resolved.  Submission acknowledged but too early for a response.

So there it is; I'm taking MyCSP responses to date as refusal to pay the correct amount.

Dear Scheme Member

Here is a brick wall. Please bang your head on it repeatedly.


OP - not surprised you're frustrated, given the above. The unhappy reality is that you now have to wait - an all too common situation in pensions.

FIREDreamer said:

Some ball park numbers might help here to judge whether the differences are rounding issues or several hundred pounds a month which would obviously be a bit odd. Was the pension reduced because you took tax free cash maybe?

OP gave it in the first post:

Emerit said:

I retired in January this year (2024).  On their 3rd attempt, I accepted the Civil Service Pension (CSP) pension quotation; £2,095/annum higher than their original quotation!  I dread to think how many people have accepted a low quotation.
Ten months on, and CSP are paying pension that falls short of the quotation (I'm down about £400/mth).  

That's one hell of a rounding error!

Sorry, I didn’t spot that. I presume this is a pension issue and not just a wrong tax code issue? It just seems to be a bizarre situation to be in.

From what OP has posted, there is most definitely a pension issue - although there could be a wrong tax code as well, just for added 'interest'....

ALogical1

I sympathise.

I too have received appalling 'service' from MyCsp, no ndoubt they spin it as really excellent 'diservice'! As a defered member looking to put into repayment as early retirement, thay have been awfully frustrating, not answering questions, not responqing to queries about values/ increases, quotation discrepancies etc. Took over 11 months through 2023-2024 from requesting to be put into payment. And there are still unanswered questions on the lack of inflationary increases - seems to be common?  An escallation was made with assurances, but not followed through despite chases etc.

Ended up sending key communication by recorded post as ther email 'responsiveness' was dire. At least the recorded post got some actions, never communcated of course. in any responses you did get they are incredibly lax is stating what to, dates or refferences etc.

They also do not comply with thier written processes / tmescales etc which has to exclusively be with the MyCsp service/account within Equinity as I have other pensions handled by Equinity (non MyCsp) and they are pretty good, they even appologise if things go amiss! 
The Equinity MD / CxOs of MyCsp should be keelhauled for the 'service' they've run in to the ground, no accountability, bonuses reclaimed, if not prevented from being able to practice in the industry.

One would like to think the Cabinett see, look for... the complaints, Truspilot, even here etc and manage them, but of course silence is generally an indicator of 'not good' otherwise they'd all be blowing their spin doctor trumpets.

Also have discovered that the legality arround pension failures is not stacked in the victims case, franckly if they make any overpayment mistakes they can redress them at any time in the future regardless if due to the providers incompetence.
The distress, angst and frustration they cause is only ever compensated penuriously, for from any real / appropriate 'compensation or culpability actions.
Considering it is all taxpayers money it is a very poor state of affairs lacking if not simply delinquent leadership and management from the Gov't and MyCsp  (that name should be challenged if not adressed by the ASA)?


Given the forthcomming shift back to Capita given they were supercceded for some reason..., you have to wonder how it will improve given no doubt staff will be Tupe'd.

Fitou143

I will be retiring at the end of this month, my papers have gone through with MyCsP and I have just had an email back to say the my Pay amount that they had on my records was incorrect, so my pension has changed. I am trying to find out how this has happened and who's fault this would be, any advice. Should I accept this and argue it out afterwards, any advice appreciated, thanks

Silvertabby

Fitou143 said:

I will be retiring at the end of this month, my papers have gone through with MyCsP and I have just had an email back to say the my Pay amount that they had on my records was incorrect, so my pension has changed. I am trying to find out how this has happened and who's fault this would be, any advice. Should I accept this and argue it out afterwards, any advice appreciated, thanks

I know this must be disappointing, but the answer is that your previous estimates were based on wrong pay figures supplied by your employer.  Now that you have started the retirement procedure, the CSPS have obtained your actual pay figures, hence the amendment to your pension.  It happens.  Just a thought, but when you looked at your estimates on MyCsP did you also check to see if the pay quoted was correct?  

Plus I suspect that the MyCsP estimates carry the rider 'these are estimated figures and should not be relied upon'.  Or words to that effect.

By all means ask for an explanation, but please don't think that registering a complaint will mean that PCSP will pay you the wrong, higher, amount.  They won't.

Marcon

Fitou143 said:

I will be retiring at the end of this month, my papers have gone through with MyCsP and I have just had an email back to say the my Pay amount that they had on my records was incorrect, so my pension has changed. I am trying to find out how this has happened and whose fault this would be, any advice. Should I accept this and argue it out afterwards, any advice appreciated, thanks

Unhappily there won't be anything to 'argue out' afterwards - you are entitled to your scheme benefits and if they can work out what those are(!), that's what you'll get.

You are still entitled to understand what went wrong, if only to put your mind at rest that the correct figures have (finally) been supplied.

GunJack

I wonder if the service will improve when Capita comes back in as scheme administrators, which they are due to do in September 2025. Stories like this give good reason why MyCSP have lost the contract ..

I for one hope so as my CS pension is due in just under 3 years.....