Found an old utility bill.

silverwhistle

Well, I'm trying alright! Solar covered my baseload earlier but being on a variable tariff which is very expensive at the moment I'm keeping my load well down at the moment, I assure you!:-)

But on a net basis, using averages I'm still paying well under the standard rates. It'll be interesting to see at the end of this month but last billing period I was averaging under 10p a unit and that's with no household battery.

The current climactic conditions are an issue to be dealt with, but there's no single silver bullet to resolve it, although having seen for many years people coming up with their newly found discoveries - "aha, but solar doesn't work at night" - it may take some time to educate the general public.

Martyn1981

And if we have around 12GW of reliable RE generation coming in from Morocco, Iceland and Canada, via sub-sea HVDC cables, then that will help massively.

Yes, I'm being a bit tongue-in-cheek, but the schemes appear to be at least theoretically viable and economic. But time will tell.

charles_b_2

michaels said:

charles_b_2 said:

The big gotcha (and likely to become a big issue very soon) is that although we have transitioned from Coal to Renewables, we have over the last few years started to incinerate rubbish rather than landfill it.  Some is generating electricity (like the new on on the Slough Estate, next to the 'Wood Pellet' power station that was commissioned earlier this year).
There is NO carbon capture, let alone all the other noxious gases and particles these will emit during their lifetime.
They are as dirty, if not dirtier than Coal power stations, yet are flying well under the radar currently.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3wxgje5pwo

1) Is it a 'big' gotcha or actually a rounding error in terms of UK global warming emissions?
2) Is it despite these emissions probably the cleanest way of disposing of this waste with burial actually leading to much higher methane emissions plus leaching of all sorts of nasties into the environment?

What we really need is a nationwide standardised recycling scheme that stops councils doing whatever suits their own green ideology.  Consistent process and a carrot approach to the population to do the right thing 'keep Britain tidy' style to reduce how much ends up in the incinerator.

michaels

charles_b_2 said:

michaels said:

charles_b_2 said:

The big gotcha (and likely to become a big issue very soon) is that although we have transitioned from Coal to Renewables, we have over the last few years started to incinerate rubbish rather than landfill it.  Some is generating electricity (like the new on on the Slough Estate, next to the 'Wood Pellet' power station that was commissioned earlier this year).
There is NO carbon capture, let alone all the other noxious gases and particles these will emit during their lifetime.
They are as dirty, if not dirtier than Coal power stations, yet are flying well under the radar currently.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3wxgje5pwo

1) Is it a 'big' gotcha or actually a rounding error in terms of UK global warming emissions?
2) Is it despite these emissions probably the cleanest way of disposing of this waste with burial actually leading to much higher methane emissions plus leaching of all sorts of nasties into the environment?

What we really need is a nationwide standardised recycling scheme that stops councils doing whatever suits their own green ideology.  Consistent process and a carrot approach to the population to do the right thing 'keep Britain tidy' style to reduce how much ends up in the incinerator.

MY loved ones can not be bothered to recycle and given the way they are happy to waste stuff I suspect even quite large financial incentives to recycle would make no difference

[Eg spend £3 on a small bottle of coke zero, drink about a quarter, get board, chuck it in general waste with the liquid still in it - they are hardly going to be incentivised by a 25p deposit on the bottle]

charles_b_2

michaels said:

charles_b_2 said:

michaels said:

charles_b_2 said:

The big gotcha (and likely to become a big issue very soon) is that although we have transitioned from Coal to Renewables, we have over the last few years started to incinerate rubbish rather than landfill it.  Some is generating electricity (like the new on on the Slough Estate, next to the 'Wood Pellet' power station that was commissioned earlier this year).
There is NO carbon capture, let alone all the other noxious gases and particles these will emit during their lifetime.
They are as dirty, if not dirtier than Coal power stations, yet are flying well under the radar currently.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3wxgje5pwo

1) Is it a 'big' gotcha or actually a rounding error in terms of UK global warming emissions?
2) Is it despite these emissions probably the cleanest way of disposing of this waste with burial actually leading to much higher methane emissions plus leaching of all sorts of nasties into the environment?

What we really need is a nationwide standardised recycling scheme that stops councils doing whatever suits their own green ideology.  Consistent process and a carrot approach to the population to do the right thing 'keep Britain tidy' style to reduce how much ends up in the incinerator.

MY loved ones can not be bothered to recycle and given the way they are happy to waste stuff I suspect even quite large financial incentives to recycle would make no difference

[Eg spend £3 on a small bottle of coke zero, drink about a quarter, get board, chuck it in general waste with the liquid still in it - they are hardly going to be incentivised by a 25p deposit on the bottle]

Yes. Unfortunately humans are rarely thinking about the wider world.  We're doomed!

Screwdriva

charles_b_2 said:

Unfortunately humans are rarely thinking about the wider world.  We're doomed!

I spend alot of my time evangelizing solar PV and insulation and, to a smaller scale, heat pumps (6 and counting). Effectively, I approach individuals who have heard of or considered these technologies and explain why the near 200 households I have helped, are happy with their investment(s).

I try to clear the clutter and compensate for the lack of credibility (read: double glazing salesmen) the industry is known for. This is done through hours of conversation in several cases, sometimes spread across many months - you'd be amazed at how high the conversion rate is once the light bulb inside their mind switches on. I believe this is the key. 

While economic reasons are a primary motivator, a very strong minority do it for the environment. Doing this work has made me very optimistic that people can make positive environmental contributions. So much so that I have now focussed personal resources to launch a venture to try to scale this up (should be able to share more on this soon). 

Perhaps the onus is on those of us who are willing, to attempt to switch on that light bulb in the minds of our friends, family and neighbours? (Well that's how I started whatever this is anyway) 

michaels

a) Congratulations
b) That sounds like a project I would volunteer to support

Niv

Exiled_Tyke said:

charles_b_2 said:

The big gotcha (and likely to become a big issue very soon) is that although we have transitioned from Coal to Renewables, we have over the last few years started to incinerate rubbish rather than landfill it.  Some is generating electricity (like the new on on the Slough Estate, next to the 'Wood Pellet' power station that was commissioned earlier this year).
There is NO carbon capture, let alone all the other noxious gases and particles these will emit during their lifetime.
They are as dirty, if not dirtier than Coal power stations, yet are flying well under the radar currently.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3wxgje5pwo

I'd like to get to the bottom of this issue.   Veolia argue that they perform strongly on noxious stuff capture. (Although to be fair to the BBC their article makes no claims about anything other than greenhouse gasses) 

https://www.leeds.veolia.co.uk/our-facility/leeds-recycling-energy-recovery-facility-rerf-works

Is this the truth or is it just PR hogwash?  

From the Veolia link:

Air pollution control

The gases from the boiler are extensively cleaned. This includes neutralising any acid gases, removing pollutants with ‘activated carbon’ and capturing fine particles with a fabric filter. The gas treatment residues known as Air Pollution Control Residues (APCr) are kept in enclosed storage on site and then transported safely to a licensed facility for further treatment and disposal. This APCr material is actually then used in further chemical processes and is used in industrial acid neutralisation.

This is 100% true. The general public would do themselves a favour if they looked into this, even a little, rather than just moaning about ERFs all the time. No technology is perfect but the controls in place on an ERF are multiple. They have permits that have recently had limits tightened and continuous monitoring of key parameters with 15minute limits that if breached have to be reported to the EA. So when I read an article on the BBC site stating something like 27 breaches in a year what they don't say is these are probably 15min breaches not some long term massive pollution event i.e they don't give any context. 

I don't really understand what 'the public' what to happen to their waste, if they think it can all be recycled then they are kidding themselves. Yes, your sandwich packaging is 'recyclable' but not once it has had a sandwich in it! There are also massive barriers to getting recycled materials back into circulation due to lack of demand.

Heedtheadvice

Crikey I was sure that was just PR given the statement "...100%true..."....

Then I read on and assumed missing quotation marks 😀

Solarchaser

It's probably on those of us who would fall under the banner of evangelists for solar, heat pumps, wind, EV's and batteries to push the message out.

I'd imagine the regular posters here are far more likely to do so, but with our own little caveats.

I push very heavily for solar, and so most of my various friend groups have adopted solar, and several now also EV's.
Heat pumps, not so much, they don't fit for me personally,  and so i encourage more research, especially about the lower temperature and slower to heat, which suits some and doesn't suit others.

My own use of batteries means the vast, vast majority of my energy use is overnight when the Scottish grid is especially clean with wind, and a calculation based on buying on peak electricity vs off peak from August 23 to August 24 showed i use 98.7% off peak energy (just before I switched to export tarrif).
But i still advise caution with battery purchases as there are plenty of fly by nights in the industry, and it needs to fit your usage also.