Octopus refund and billing errors

mah14681

Ever since the additional payments were made by the government to help with energy bills, we've had them paid to Octopus. Our balance rose steadily, we made choices to switch to lower fixed tarrifs when available. Our meter readings may not be as regular as they'd like but fit in with the intermediate estimates. For the last year at least possibly up to three, the balance was around £1,000 to £1,500 in credit.

I requested by email to siwtch to a lower, fixed tarrif as the savings were greater than exit fees over twelve months. No response, so another email later and I eventually saw the exit fees applied to our account. Still no other response. I thought nothing more of it as it might just have been a forgetful service agent.

I decided in August to try to refund of some credit so submitted meter readings as advised. The online account wouldn't allow the request. I did this two more times. Today, 25th October I decided to call. I was put on hold to look at the account and eventually put through to another agent. The new agent took my details and query again and kept me on the line to prevent being put back into the queue. They needed to rebill my account before the refund could be done which, I understand. They couldn't complete it and had to refer to the billing team. They said they'd sent an email to confirm an open enquiry but couldn't do any more. Later this evening I check my account and they've billed almost £1,000 and the credit is now just over £300.

No meter readings or estimates are any different to before, even on the new bills. Is this acceptable? I've asked by email for a full explanation, because I know they receive them however, I've yet to receive anything from them.

I'm a systems engineer and technician for over 25 years at all levels and only had a problem with my email address with the local council where they wouldn't accept a hyphen in the domain. Microsoft forwarding issues got it blocked only at Microsoft a decade ago but that was resolved immediately. I'm more interested in the billing practice - if it's acceptable and if anyone else has tried communicating with Octopus by email and not got any replies?

cannugec5

So, in August you submitted a reading and requested a refund of a credit balance. 

Nothing happened. 

You chased it up in October and got a smaller refund than anticipated. 

That is 2-3 months more energy usage from August to October. Of course the credit available to refund is less.  

However if you could share your KWh usage people might be able to better inform whether these monetary amounts  are appropriate. 

Qyburn

And meter readings. When you requested the refund, what was your actual meter reading, and what was the date and actual reading in the most recent prior bill?

MattMattMattUK

mah14681 said:

Ever since the additional payments were made by the government to help with energy bills, we've had them paid to Octopus. Our balance rose steadily, we made choices to switch to lower fixed tarrifs when available. Our meter readings may not be as regular as they'd like but fit in with the intermediate estimates. For the last year at least possibly up to three, the balance was around £1,000 to £1,500 in credit.

I requested by email to siwtch to a lower, fixed tarrif as the savings were greater than exit fees over twelve months. No response, so another email later and I eventually saw the exit fees applied to our account. Still no other response. I thought nothing more of it as it might just have been a forgetful service agent.

I decided in August to try to refund of some credit so submitted meter readings as advised. The online account wouldn't allow the request. I did this two more times. Today, 25th October I decided to call. I was put on hold to look at the account and eventually put through to another agent. The new agent took my details and query again and kept me on the line to prevent being put back into the queue. They needed to rebill my account before the refund could be done which, I understand. They couldn't complete it and had to refer to the billing team. They said they'd sent an email to confirm an open enquiry but couldn't do any more. Later this evening I check my account and they've billed almost £1,000 and the credit is now just over £300.

No meter readings or estimates are any different to before, even on the new bills. Is this acceptable? I've asked by email for a full explanation, because I know they receive them however, I've yet to receive anything from them.

I agree with the others, I suspect this is an issue caused by pervious estimated bills and now that things have been brought up to date the reality is that there is a significantly reduced credit. Can you post copies of the previous bills and the new ones, with personal details redacted?

mah14681 said:

I'm a systems engineer and technician for over 25 years at all levels and only had a problem with my email address with the local council where they wouldn't accept a hyphen in the domain. Microsoft forwarding issues got it blocked only at Microsoft a decade ago but that was resolved immediately. I'm more interested in the billing practice - if it's acceptable and if anyone else has tried communicating with Octopus by email and not got any replies?

Is this in any way relevant, or just random information?

mah14681

mah14681 said:

I'm a systems engineer and technician for over 25 years at all levels and only had a problem with my email address with the local council where they wouldn't accept a hyphen in the domain. Microsoft forwarding issues got it blocked only at Microsoft a decade ago but that was resolved immediately. I'm more interested in the billing practice - if it's acceptable and if anyone else has tried communicating with Octopus by email and not got any replies?

Is this in any way relevant, or just random information?

Not completely random, I suspected I'd be told to check the junk folder for the missing messages from Octopus. Anyway it got me thinking so I checked a device I don't use often which I'd left on to stay up to date with security updates. I'd left it logged in with Outlook open and there were rules acting on the messages from Octopus exporting and archiving to my document store. So I feel a little more silly now.

What makes me feel even sillier is actually looking at the dates on the statements. I switched to a new fixed tarrif in May. My statement for October 14th was for estimated meter readings up to 25th May excluding any charges for the new tarrif. The latest statement brings this up to date and I suspect if I look back through all my statements this is happening quite regularly, particularly when I choose a new fixed rate.

Thanks you all for your input, you were right and it looks like this idiot over-reacted.

MattMattMattUK

mah14681 said:

mah14681 said:

I'm a systems engineer and technician for over 25 years at all levels and only had a problem with my email address with the local council where they wouldn't accept a hyphen in the domain. Microsoft forwarding issues got it blocked only at Microsoft a decade ago but that was resolved immediately. I'm more interested in the billing practice - if it's acceptable and if anyone else has tried communicating with Octopus by email and not got any replies?

Is this in any way relevant, or just random information?

Not completely random, I suspected I'd be told to check the junk folder for the missing messages from Octopus. Anyway it got me thinking so I checked a device I don't use often which I'd left on to stay up to date with security updates. I'd left it logged in with Outlook open and there were rules acting on the messages from Octopus exporting and archiving to my document store. So I feel a little more silly now.

On the plus side you know the Outlook rules work, the server side ones regularly refuse to for me.

mah14681 said:

What makes me feel even sillier is actually looking at the dates on the statements. I switched to a new fixed tarrif in May. My statement for October 14th was for estimated meter readings up to 25th May excluding any charges for the new tarrif. The latest statement brings this up to date and I suspect if I look back through all my statements this is happening quite regularly, particularly when I choose a new fixed rate.

It happens, those of us who have been on here some time have seen it a lot, estimated bills are the cause of the vast majority if misunderstandings, huge bills, billing confusion etc. Potentially worth submitting meter reads every month if you can, or if you want to make life even easier get Octopus to install a smart meter.

mah14681 said:
Thanks you all for your input, you were right and it looks like this idiot over-reacted.

We all make mistakes and making mistakes does not make someone an idiot, refusing to learn from those mistakes is what defines an idiot, but you have already figured out the issue, so proving your lack of idiocy. 

Grizzlebeard

Thank you mah14681.

It is really refreshing to read a thread with sensible comment and a good conclusion, where the Original Poster didn't double down and get defensive.

Cudos.

mah14681

Grizzlebeard said:

Thank you mah14681.

It is really refreshing to read a thread with sensible comment and a good conclusion, where the Original Poster didn't double down and get defensive.

Cudos.

It's difficult to admit your mistakes or if you're wrong. I find it good for myself to have humility and am glad to know I am wrong, or how else will I learn?

MattMattMattUK said:

mah14681 said:

What makes me feel even sillier is actually looking at the dates on the statements. I switched to a new fixed tarrif in May. My statement for October 14th was for estimated meter readings up to 25th May excluding any charges for the new tarrif. The latest statement brings this up to date and I suspect if I look back through all my statements this is happening quite regularly, particularly when I choose a new fixed rate.

It happens, those of us who have been on here some time have seen it a lot, estimated bills are the cause of the vast majority if misunderstandings, huge bills, billing confusion etc. Potentially worth submitting meter reads every month if you can, or if you want to make life even easier get Octopus to install a smart meter.

I've been submitting meter readings multiple times a month for the past few months, I think it's possibly due to the tarrif change and their workload.

I entertained the smart meter option during the pandemic, but it got delayed and we were sceptical with the 3G switch off so avoided it for now. I've submitted regular meter readings every month or so but missing one or two. I did have July, August, September and October covered but they've only been used in the statement when I requested a refund, so suspect their processes to be a quarter behind for billing. My better half is reluctant to introduce new technology too, possibly because I work with it every day and know the pitfalls but, it's now proven and those issues are behind us for the best part.

Ildhund

mah14681 said:

... we were sceptical with the 3G switch off so avoided it for now. 

Why?

• O2 (Telefonica) have contracted to provide communications for the smart meter network until 2028;
• If there's no 3G signal, the connection will revert to 2G, which is perfectly capable of handling the tiny amounts of data a smart meter receives and sends;
• 2G and 3G will finally be consigned to history in 2033, although individual services will be terminated before then.
• Vodafone have been contracted to provide communication for 15 years over their LTE 4G network. Trials have already started with new types of communications hub. 

I don't think the 3G switch-off should have any bearing on a decision whether or not to opt for a smart meter.

Phones4Chris

Ildhund said:

mah14681 said:

... we were sceptical with the 3G switch off so avoided it for now. 

Why?

• O2 (Telefonica) have contracted to provide communications for the smart meter network until 2028;
• If there's no 3G signal, the connection will revert to 2G, which is perfectly capable of handling the tiny amounts of data a smart meter receives and sends;
• 2G and 3G will finally be consigned to history in 2033, although individual services will be terminated before then.
• Vodafone have been contracted to provide communication for 15 years over their LTE 4G network. Trials have already started with new types of communications hub. 

I don't think the 3G switch-off should have any bearing on a decision whether or not to opt for a smart meter.

Except, worth checking what your O2 and Vodafone 2G signals are like, they may not be as good as your 3G.
For example on one network I get lousy 2G, even worse 3G but much better 4G.

Ildhund

Thanks. I use both, as it happens: my O2 phone shows 0-1 bars, but seems to work as expected most of the time. I wouldn't know how to tell which flavour of network it's connecting to*. My Internet connection is provided by an LTE 4G modem/router with a Vodafone SIM pointed towards a mast three miles away over the hill. It gives me 30Mbits on a good day.

A lousy 2G connection is probably quite good enough for the SMWAN.

*  PS I just installed an app (Android 14, "Network Cell Info Lite") to tell me what my phone's up to. It reported that I was on O2 LTE with a -115dBm RSSI connection (in the app's red zone). When I restricted the phone to connecting to 2G, it showed 4 bars and -80dBm.