Road Tax

another_victim_newbie

Hi all.

Looking for some advice on a situation I have found myself in. Firstly, I am fully aware that this is my mistake, however rest assured, it’s a complete honest mistake! 

I pay monthly for my road tax and received a notification in the summer to say it was coming to the end. However, I thought (thought wrong) my road tax would auto renew. Apparently not. 

I went for my haircut in Manchester City centre and came back to find my car clamped with a notice on my car saying “untaxed vehicle” - I was absolutely mortified and fully blame myself. I paid £269 in total fines to get my car back. This occurred on 13/08/2024. I of course, immediately taxed my car.

I have now received a letter from the DVLA stating that they have evidence in the same location above that my vehicle was untaxed. And now stating I have 14 days to pay £255.00. 

Is this something they can do? It seems harsh for my to be stung twice. I know an honest mistake won’t hold up in court but I can’t believe they have come for me with another hefty fine. 

Any advice on this would be greatly appreciated. 

elsien

Who was the first fine from?

Goudy

It sounds like you have two fines.

One is a PCN (plus clamp release fee) from Manchester City Council for a parking infringement, ie parking an untaxed vehicle on the roads they control.
This is a civil penalty.

The other a fixed penalty from DVLA as it has been seen on the road (therefore being used) untaxed.
It was probably Manchester City Council that reported it to DVLA.
For this your out of court settlement is some like £30 plus 150% of the outstanding tax.
This one is a penalty backed by the power criminal prosecution. I think they call it a mitigated penalty, so no criminal record.

These days honest mistakes are expensive but I don't think you can appeal either I'm afraid, you were untaxed.

As far as Manchester City Council are concerned, you parked an untaxed vehicle on the roads they control and there's a PCN for that.
As far as DVLA are concerned, your car was witnessed on the road untaxed and there is a FPN for that.

My Mrs got done the same way.
She "forgot" to renew the tax, actually she never received a V5C or tax reminder as someone screwed up our address on the V55 when she bought the car new, so she basically forgot she didn't get the V5C and it needed taxing after the first year.

The local council slapped her with a PCN as it was parked on the street and she thought nothing more off it after paying the PCN and taxing the thing.
But to tax it she had to contact DVLA as you can't tax a vehicle without a V5C or tax reminder, so fixed penalty notice for the time it was untaxed turned up a few weeks later and somehow it was my fault!

Bigphil1474

Don't think that's correct. I've never heard of a Council issuing FPN's for untaxed vehicles. I'd guess that the first fine was to pay for the de-clamping and the second fine was for not having tax for however many months. I pay monthly on DD and mine just rolls over, so not sure why the OP's didn't.

la531983

Local councils wont be clamping cars in parking bays (with paid parking I assume?) for someone going spending an hour having a haircut, regardless if the car has tax or not, something doesnt scan right here.

Keep_pedalling

la531983 said:

Local councils wont be clamping cars in parking bays (with paid parking I assume?) for someone going spending an hour having a haircut, regardless if the car has tax or not, something doesnt scan right here.

Yes they do.

https://www.manchester.gov.uk/info/471/tickets_and_fines/594/vehicle_clamping_and_releasing

la531983

Keep_pedalling said:

la531983 said:

Local councils wont be clamping cars in parking bays (with paid parking I assume?) for someone going spending an hour having a haircut, regardless if the car has tax or not, something doesnt scan right here.

Yes they do.

https://www.manchester.gov.uk/info/471/tickets_and_fines/594/vehicle_clamping_and_releasing

Fair enough, never even realised they checked the tax on cars tbh, assumed they only looked for parking infringements and no/expired tickets!

Goudy

Everything's digital these days, they just drive up and down in little vans with cameras on them reading number plates catching every infringement.

So tax, MOT and insurance can be checked digitally on the move and as parking is no longer metered at the road side but done via apps or by phone, they can check if it's paid up to park as well.

The council aren't/can't issue FPNs.
They issue PCNs, clamp and tow away vehicles on the roads they control.
You pay those fees and fines to the council.

DVLA will issue a FPN for using a vehicle on the road without tax.
I believe it's £30 plus 150% of the dodged/forgotten tax or £30 and 200% if the vehicle was registered as SORN and still used on the road.
You pay those fines to DVLA Enforcement Centre.

What has happened is the Council have spotted it parked on the road they control and clamped it because it was untaxed.
It doesn't matter if it's parking is paid up or not, it's untaxed.
So the owner pays the fine/fee to the Council to get it back.

DVLA have then also issued the registered keeper with a FPN for using a untaxed vehicle on the road.
The registered keeper will have to pay that to DVLA.

DVLA know it's untaxed from their records but they now have a witness it was used on the road untaxed, the council.
It's they have have reported the offence to DVLA.

The Council have had their slice, now DVLA want theirs.

Nasqueron

You can get an annual reminder of your VED (road tax doesn't exist) from the DVLA, they send me an email each year confirming the DD is going out. If that doesn't happen, then you can do it manually in good time.

Car_54

Goudy said:

.

DVLA have then also issued the registered keeper with a FPN for using a untaxed vehicle on the road.
The registered keeper will have to pay that to DVLA.

DVLA know it's untaxed from their records but they now have a witness it was used on the road untaxed, the council.
It's they have have reported the offence to DVLA.

The Council have had their slice, now DVLA want theirs.

As you say, DVLA know it was untaxed. That is an offence in itself, whether used on the road or not, and their system would automatically generate an out-of-court settlement offer.

They don't need to know it was used on the road. I think it's unlikely that the council would report it, since that could potentially require witness statements etc. Also "Not our problem"!

Mildly_Miffed

I'm only surprised that you didn't get a penalty letter through from DVLA in the months between your tax expiring and you getting caught using an untaxed car.

It's been an offence since the 1990s to have a car that's not EITHER taxed OR sorned.
(It's also been an offence for nearly 15 years to have a car that's not insured UNLESS it's sorned.)

Why didn't the tax auto-renew? Two possibilities.
1. You haven't set a DD up to auto-renew. Since you received a V11 tax reminder, this is the most likely.
2. Your MOT expired just before the tax renewal.

It's not two penalties for the same thing...
The initial penalty was the cost of getting the clamp removed.
This second penalty is the penalty for having an untaxed car.

The question is why you ignored the V11...