ECP Fine even though ticket purchased - Disputed and now letter from Debt Recovery Plus

Biasmatty123

Claim form has turned up today, issued 12th September. More than 5 days have passed so I assume I am ok to move onto acknowledging service of a claim via MCOL and then prepare my defence which I have 33 days to submit? Which I need to read: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6108153/suggested-template-defence-to-adapt-for-all-parking-charge-cases-where-they-add-false-admin-costs/p1 and look at the second post which is the defence template? Thanks again 

Gr1pr

Correct 

Post the Issue date from the top right of the claim form below and also post a redacted picture of the POC from the lower left of the claim form below after hiding the VRM details first 

The deadline is 4pm 33 days after the issue date,  once the AOS online stage is completed on MCOL 

Coupon-mad

Biasmatty123 said:

Hi all,

I have read through the newbies thread but still slight confused and after some reassurance.

Parked in an Euro Car park, Ticket machines were not working due to there being an issue with phone networks in the area that day. Managed to get the machine to work after trying for around 12mins (Also tried on the app but again due to signal issues was unsuccessful) Paid for 2 hours came back and left with a few mins to spare of the time shown on the ticket.

A few weeks pass and a fine came through from ECP, which we disputed with them informing them of the above, they have said we did not pay for the amount of time the car had entered and left, informed them of the reason. Heard nothing back other than automated email back to the dispute. Unfortunately we filled out the dispute online so we have declared who the driver was.

A few months have passed with no response from them but have now had a letter from Debt Recovery Plus.

What would you advise at this stage? 

Sounds like a 5 minute rule case, for which we have a bespoke defence but please state the exact timings - arrival hour / minute / second, then payment time then leaving time - so we can be sure.

Biasmatty123

@Gr1pr the issue date is 12th Sep 2025 here is the POC



@Coupon-mad Arrived at 14:21:59, managed to buy ticket at 14:32 after finding a machine that worked which was far away from the car, Car park was a pay and display, gravel stoned and poorly maintained so not the quickest to walk across to get back to the car with the ticket. Plus reading signage for T&Cs which you needed a magnifying glass to see, Left car park at 16:34:29. Paid for 2 hours parking. Parking for 2 hours was £2.90. Car park is now gone and turned into Flats.. 

Coupon-mad

Biasmatty123 said in 2024:

Parked in an Euro Car park, Ticket machines were not working due to there being an issue with phone networks in the area that day. Managed to get the machine to work after trying for around 12mins (Also tried on the app but again due to signal issues was unsuccessful) Paid for 2 hours came back and left with a few mins to spare of the time shown on the ticket.

A few weeks pass and a fine came through from ECP, which we disputed with them informing them of the above, they have said we did not pay for the amount of time the car had entered and left, informed them of the reason. Heard nothing back other than automated email back to the dispute. Unfortunately we filled out the dispute online so we have declared who the driver was.

A few months have passed with no response from them but have now had a letter from Debt Recovery Plus.


UPDATE: claim form 2025

"the issue date is 12th Sep 2025 here is the POC"



@Coupon-mad Arrived at 14:21:59, managed to buy ticket at 14:32 after finding a machine that worked which was far away from the car, Car park was a pay and display, gravel stoned and poorly maintained so not the quickest to walk across to get back to the car with the ticket. Plus reading signage for T&Cs which you needed a magnifying glass to see, Left car park at 16:34:29.

Paid for 2 hours parking. Parking for 2 hours was £2.90.

Looks like it only took c10 minutes to pay, which isn't bad bearing in mind the driver tried one machine several times (faulty) then tried to download an app (it failed) then walked across the car park to find another machine.

At that point, the contract had not started until the 'green button' was pressed. Search the forum for:

NCP HMRC green button

Incorporate the wording you find a out that case into your para 3 within the template defence.

These PCNs are only coming about because the arrival and IMHO poor (non-motorist-friendly) practices of IPC caused a race to the bottom and the BPA dropped safeguards such as the 'observation period' their Code of Practice used to require. Now known as a consideration period, which the MHCLG must ensure IS in the statutory Code, coming in.

For me, in a car park with payment required the consideration period should be a bare minimum of ten minutes at the start.

Le_Kirk

With an issue date of 12/09/25 and providing you complete the AoS after 17/09/25 and before 01/10/25

your defence deadline date is 4.00 p.m. on 15/10/25

Biasmatty123

Defence Template Changes:

2. The allegation(s) and heads of cost are vague and liability is denied for the sum claimed, or at all. At the very least, interest should be disallowed; the delay in bringing proceedings lies with the Claimant. This also makes retrieving material documents/evidence difficult, which is highly prejudicial. The Defendant seeks fixed costs (CPR 27.14) and a finding of unreasonable conduct and further costs (CPR 46.5). The Defendant has little recollection of events, save as set out below and to admit that they were the registered keeper and driver.

3. I deny the allegation in the POC, due to the time taken to find a space in the car park and then find a working ticket machine which on the day in question multiple machines were not working there was a period of time taken to purchase a ticket. 

3.1 . In a 2019 Court of Appeal decision, in the case between NCP (Appellant) and HMRC (Respondent), it was made clear that the offer and acceptance of a parking contract can only take place once the payer has inserted payment into the machine and pressed the green button to obtain a ticket.

3.2. I was back in my car within the time paid for parking and 2 mins after the ANPR cameras log the car leaving the premises. The updated Code of Practise published by the British Parking Association offers motorists a 10-minute "grace period" before they impose a charge for overstaying.

Not sure if I am on the right lines here or not apologies. 

Gr1pr

A defence is written in the 3rd person,  no I etc

Coupon-mad

But the rest is good, except:

Code of Practise

should be

Code of Practice