Is it possible to cancel no-fault claim through own insurance company?

markgerrard

My son recently had a not at fault crash, he's only 17 and has only been driving around 6 months.

The actual accident involved 3 cars at a mini roundabout and the car at fault failed to give way to a car turning right, they collided and the that car was shunted back into my son's car, causing front bumper damage (predominately at the driver side).

The car was still fully drivable and only really cosmetic damage, due to his age the car was only bought for around £3000 2010 plate Peugeot 107 1l (albeit had £600 repairs needed quite quickly as well as me having a £300 car play stereo fitted). Insurance wasn't too bad in his name for £1700 per year with Ticker / blackbox).

I made the claim through Ticker who outsource their claims to Carpenters Solicitors who I now feel are a little dodgy as when they asked did he have any pain only an hour after the crash, within a couple of days he had doctors and physio appointments.

We were contacted by Enterprise Rent-A-Car for a courtesy car which I don't think was through ticker as I had to tell them all the details again and they said they claim of the at fault driver etc...

The final part of the process we were told the car would be picked up by a company called CoPart, my son initially delayed collection for a week, but it was picked up last Friday. I called on his behalf today to see when the car would be returned as we hadn't heard anything and was assuming it was being repaired.

On the phone call Carpenters who provide the claim management services asked what company it had gone to I think one was ALG or something and I knew it wasn't that one, the other was CoPart who it turns out are a big salvage merchant. They said as it had gone to CoPart it was likely being written off (it looks like this was decided yet no one made us aware of this).

When he read the report he says it is indeed being written off as repair will be more than 60% of car value. They've valued the car at £2100 and you guessed it the cost of repairs at £2100.

I am now being told I can either have the £2100 or buy the car back for £500, a payment of £800 and £800 excess back if all goes through no fault which it should.

I've looked today and the cost of the bumper (plastic) is around £125, surely painting and fitting wouldn't be more than £600 so that's only £725 and around 30% of the car value?

What I do think is that the claims handling solicitors are in cahoots with CoPart and they upscaled the cost of repairs to make it a right off so they can buy the car for £500 (with the £300 new CarPlay stereo in it), fix it for £500 and sell it for £2000 (obviously getting a kick back).

I'm not really happy with the car being written off due to the implications on insurance, is it possible to cancel the claim at this stage and if necessary paying say £500 to cover any costs, or even taking it to an independent garage for cost to repair so the vehicle isn't written off in the 1st place and fixed under the current claim.

What options do I have to salvage (no pun intended) this issue? I've also complained as they never let me know that they had already decided by choice of place they sent it that it was being written off, they say they say it at end of call so I have requested call recordings with a SAR.

Also they had the cheek to say to me that the car may come back more damaged than when it left due to it going to a car salvages, which we were never made aware of at point of claim.

Thanks for any input and help.

Mark Gerrard

Nobbie1967

I think you’re stuck with the claims management company now that you have taken the hire car and the car has gone to salvage. As they say, cars are often further damaged when they are forklifted around the salvage site. Probably too late to prevent the write off marker being applied as well. For older cars it’s useful to approach the third party first to see if they will accept liability and make a compensation payment while you keep the car. I’ve done this on my last two cars which were both hit while stationary, so no doubt about liability.

Baldytyke88

You have been given a hire car at £xxx cost, so I don't think going back to square one is an option.

markgerrard

Baldytyke88 said:

You have been given a hire car at £xxx cost, so I don't think going back to square one is an option.

Yeah I thought that, but the way I think that happened was in a way independent to the actual car being fixed.

It was directly with Enterprise and I think a credit hire agreement so they're going to claim that back independently from the main insurance company.

I assume that even if I don't make a claim for repairs, Enterprise can still make that side of the claim for a car for my son to use, whilst his was being repaired, surely the at fault party's insurer would rather only pay a claim for the car hire than for the car hire and the write off?

In the event it can't I would offer to cover the cost of the car hire, say £500 if it prevents the car being written off, the car insurance policy staying in place for another 6 months £800 and not having to say the car was written off (purely for cosmetic reasons on future insurance policies).

When I contacted the claims line they didn't make me aware that they'd already decided to write it off due to choice of companies they decided to collect the car as I wouldn't have pursued the claim if I did. It's obviously a scam aimed at writing car values down and damage up, so they can salvage them and then turn them around.

markgerrard

Nobbie1967 said:

I think you’re stuck with the claims management company now that you have taken the hire car and the car has gone to salvage. As they say, cars are often further damaged when they are forklifted around the salvage site. Probably too late to prevent the write off marker being applied as well. For older cars it’s useful to approach the third party first to see if they will accept liability and make a compensation payment while you keep the car. I’ve done this on my last two cars which were both hit while stationary, so no doubt about liability.

How is it my fault when they didn't tell me upfront the car was going to salvage, I've asked for call recordings as both my son and myself were on the call and we assumed it was being taken to have body work done?

I'll cover the cost of the hire car if necessary but I'm not accepting any damage done by the salvage company as I wasn't even made aware it was going there. Why should I? 

Nobbie1967

markgerrard said:

Nobbie1967 said:

I think you’re stuck with the claims management company now that you have taken the hire car and the car has gone to salvage. As they say, cars are often further damaged when they are forklifted around the salvage site. Probably too late to prevent the write off marker being applied as well. For older cars it’s useful to approach the third party first to see if they will accept liability and make a compensation payment while you keep the car. I’ve done this on my last two cars which were both hit while stationary, so no doubt about liability.

How is it my fault when they didn't tell me upfront the car was going to salvage, I've asked for call recordings as both my son and myself were on the call and we assumed it was being taken to have body work done?

I'll cover the cost of the hire car if necessary but I'm not accepting any damage done by the salvage company as I wasn't even made aware it was going there. Why should I? 

When you go through your own insurer to claim off a third party, you have given them authority to make all the decisions regarding the cars future and they will do whatever is most convenient. All but the most trivial damage on a 14 year old 107 is going to result in a writeoff. Many have agreements with companies like Copart to offer them all accident damaged cars that might be considered for writeoff.

I think you’ll be banging your head against a brick wall trying to reverse this now.

Brie

well you might bang your head against a brick wall but I think you should at least try to get the car back and a payment towards repairs that you arrange yourself.  slight headache perhaps but why not try?

As for recalling the claim - no, you're beyond that now.

And as a side thought....Enterprise was willing to give a rental to a 17 yo?  I thought their minimum age was 25?  Or did you take the rental and son used your car in the meantime?

markgerrard

Brie said:

well you might bang your head against a brick wall but I think you should at least try to get the car back and a payment towards repairs that you arrange yourself.  slight headache perhaps but why not try?

As for recalling the claim - no, you're beyond that now.

And as a side thought....Enterprise was willing to give a rental to a 17 yo?  I thought their minimum age was 25?  Or did you take the rental and son used your car in the meantime?

Hey Brie,

I've gotten a quote for the bumper to be replaced and sprayed, by a guy that does my car lease returns touch ups.

He says using a generic bumper replacing and painting should be no more than £500, I'm hoping that as that's less than 25% of the cars £2,100 they'll accept and pay that rather than writing the car of which seems silly. If they don't then I'm going to take them to the Ombudsman as it looks like they are trying to scam the other insurance company.

It is very strange that the salvage yard valid the repairs at £2,100 with the cars value at £2,100. That reeks of a scam to me, I believe they were hoping to get the car for £500 they would be able to fix the bumper for around £300 cost and then they sell it on for £1.5k ish and make £800 on the car. It's just been fitted with a £300 double din JVC CarPlay stereo, there's no way I would have left that in if it was being scrapped.

My biggest issue with a write off is it's only half way through a £1,700 policy, if they fix it rather than write it off, the existing insurance stands doesn't it, till renewal?

With regards to Enterprise it was a little funny as essentially I was entering into a credit hire agreement with them and they are going to claim back from at fault party, I had to give someone their all details of crash, cars and drivers. So it wasn't just a case of them being car rental place.

The fact that my son was only 17 meant that I had to be the main driver and they had a broker sought out the required insurance for him being 17. This was also done by Enterprise with broker on my behalf.

Thanks

GrumpyDil

Copart will put the car straight into auction if they think they can get more money from it than by purely scrapping it. 

Your best bet is likely going to be agree that they write the car off, sell it back to you and you repair it. 

It's not the worst situation, my daughter's boyfriend has had his car written off as cat N twice and has actually been paid out more than he paid for the car.

By the way your wording is confusing as you keep referring to I but any complaint will need to be in his name based on the fact I think this is his insurance policy. Also if he either buys a new car or repairs his existing the insurance is likely to be able to continue. 

markgerrard

GrumpyDil said:

Copart will put the car straight into auction if they think they can get more money from it than by purely scrapping it. 

Your best bet is likely going to be agree that they write the car off, sell it back to you and you repair it. 

It's not the worst situation, my daughter's boyfriend has had his car written off as cat N twice and has actually been paid out more than he paid for the car.

By the way your wording is confusing as you keep referring to I but any complaint will need to be in his name based on the fact I think this is his insurance policy. Also if he either buys a new car or repairs his existing the insurance is likely to be able to continue. 

Thanks for your reply, I thought an insurance policy stopped with a write off, so if he buys it back for the £500 they want then, I've lost around £800-850 as the policy only started in April.

If the same policy continues after the car being bought back it's not as big a problem. As they said they are willing to give us £1600 back after the £500 for the car but have to wait for the £800 excess back at some point.

I'm getting the car sent back as it stands, buying it back for £500 due to it being written off. However if I complain to the Ombudsman and show that the repairs are only £500 and the car is valued at £2100 then it's less than the 60% and should never have been written off in the first place.

I've seen your entitled to have the car repaired wherever you choose, so surely I should be able to go down that route. I'm not interested what deals the shady claims management solicitors Carpenters have with CoPart, I never agreed to it and I am asking for call recordings.

If my 17 year old son agreed to anything on the collection form it won't be legally binding due to him being under 18 and a minor, thus any contract he enters into is voidable until he is 18 and a reasonable time after that.

If Carpenters would have told me about scrapping it, I would have told them not to proceed with the claim, they obviously get a kick back from CoPart on their agreement and it's a scam.

Why should the at fault driver's insurance company have to pay the £2,100 write off cost of my sons vehicle if I can get the damage repaired for £500, surely that is insurance fraud, by the claims management company who will be claiming this from the at fault party?

It's no wonder insurance premiums are so high with cowboy claims management company and car auctioneers like CoPart working in cahoots, to defraud people and other insurance companies.

Regards

sheramber

From what I understand  insurance company repairs are not done with generic parts. Because repairs are guaranteed they only use manufacturer parts which will be more expensive. 

The repairer that they use will probably charge more per hour than a local repairer.

The insurance company are not going to pay out unnecessarily for “an arrangement “ between a management company and CoPart.