Pension Advisor would want £21,000 for a failed transfer

michael1234

Well, in the tradition of many threads on MSE, I thought I'd continue my pension battle with an update.

Today I received the Abridged Advice. Interestingly there is almost no analysis of my existing pension. The closest is a single figure of around £700 per month "if I keep my current benefits". Doesn't seem like much for 500k. This is copied/pasted and is the full text of the Conclusion section.

Conclusion – My recommendation The outcome of my analysis is – Inconclusive. Given your objectives and personal circumstances, a transfer might be suitable for you. However, it is not possible to determine this for certain without conducting a detailed analysis, which can only happen through Full Advice.

So perhaps so far so good but before I agree to be on the hook for ten grand I'd like to get some idea that assuming a negative recommendation at Full Advice, how likely is it they'd accept me as Insistent?

If they don't, how much time should I give myself to do the transfer myself? The current CETV expires around Jan 20. My current thought is to pay £300 and get another CETV and ask that Grove do their Full Advice based upon that. To give me more time basically... Any thoughts on this much appreciated?

Here they give some idea about Insistent Client liklihood of being accepted. Seems worrying and slightly crazy (?) that you sort of have to sing for your own supper with all this "in your own words..." and "satisfy by advisor that..." etc They also don't say if there is an additional fee for all of that.
https://www.grove-pensions.co.uk/defined-benefit-pension-transfer/insistent-clients/

cloud_dog

Isn't the outcome of the full / paid for advice irrelevant to you?

You have a Stakeholder pension set up.  Stakeholder pensions must accept transfers.  You will have confirmation of receiving the requisite advice (irrespective of outcome).  What else is there?

michael1234

cloud_dog said:

Isn't the outcome of the full / paid for advice irrelevant to you?

You have a Stakeholder pension set up.  Stakeholder pensions must accept transfers.  You will have confirmation of receiving the requisite advice (irrespective of outcome).  What else is there?

Fear of the unknown I suppose. If for whatever reason they decline to "do" the transfer I wouldn't know where to start doing it myself and most importantly doing it within the time frame as if I'm late that's 10K down the pan !

MallyGirl

you just ask your stakeholder pension to do it

michael1234

So I got this email today:

Good afternoon Michael,

Thank you for your email.

On average, it will take 1-2 more months; however, this is dependant on whether further third-party information is needed and whether there is a live deadline. We will prioritise cases with a live deadline, so you have a chance of meeting it. [Just a chance??]

We will advise on the Transfer Value we hold at the time, so currently this is X. Are you intending to get a new value?

Now the person who wrote this is the admin person but some things are worrying the heebeejeebies out of of me. The 1-2 months is for the Full Advice. Does the person understand that if I don't meet the deadline I will lose ten thousand pounds ? And am I intending to get a new CETV? Well I don't know - I asked her that question. It costs £350 each time but I've no idea when to request it.

If I had just gone through the motions and signed the last automated email they might have just carried on and produced the Full Advice too late. Perhaps naively, I thought they would help keep good track of this.

I'm really wondering now how to approach this further as (understandably) the service they provide from their side is Full Advice and if they meet the deadline great but if they ask me for some virtually impossible document to provide I lose all that money.

Sorry this turned out into a bit of a rant but I would be grateful if someone knows how to respond to this without me saying "....DO YOU REALISE YOU ARE MM AWAY FROM COSTING ME 10K ??????...."

and/or

"I DONT WANT TO BE IN A POSITION TO FIND DIFFICULT DOCUMENTS UNDER PRESSURE OF TIME - CANT YOU TELL ME _NOW_ WHAT THEY ARE LIKELY TO BE ??"

HappyHarry

The adviser will ask the DB pension administrators for all the necessary information, and will then go back to them again for the information that wasn't provided the first time of asking. This is this bit that takes the time - I have seen administrators with an 8 week turn around for such queries. 

The information you will need to provide should be fairly straightforward, and you will not need much time to get it together. You will know most of the answers off the top of your head.

It is best for the adviser to ask for the CETV along with the other queries they have, as that gives them a fighting chance of getting the information in time.

Advising on a DB transfer is not a quick process, and can be incredibly frustrating for the client. 

michael1234

Thanks a lot for that insight HH. I wonder if the additional information would be things such as proof of assets and proof of income? The former could be fun as I own a property in Ukraine - deeds in Ukranian of course.

HappyHarry

michael1234 said:

Thanks a lot for that insight HH. I wonder if the additional information would be things such as proof of assets and proof of income? The former could be fun as I own a property in Ukraine - deeds in Ukranian of course.

The adviser should be able to take your word for that and not require proof.

michael1234

So now I get:

We cannot really advise on that; it is at your discretion. We have a live guarantee date on file with an expiry date of 12/01/25, so we are still working towards this date. The issue is that we have no control over the Transfer Value calculations, so we cannot determine whether it will go up if you obtain a new one.

They really think it would be a good idea to continue even though the Full Advice process hasn't started as I haven't signed their form yet. Don't understand how that is having my best interests at heart. Jan 12 with Xmas and NY inbetween ? Even if by some miracle it gets done by then, it wold mean every day for a fortnight me worrying over it. Not really how I want to start 2025.

Surely I'd be better off paying £300 in Jan for a new CETV and ask them to work off that come January ?

AlanP_2

Based on the transfer I did a few years ago and various threads on here I would say you have more chance of seeing the real Santa
and his reindeer on Christmas Eve than they have of completing the analysis and putting the transfer through by 12th Jan 25.

The IFA I used was linked to a deal put in place by the pension trustees. He had carried out numerous transfer analysis and activities from the scheme so knew most basic facts already thus limiting questions that needed to be asked if administrators.

In addition they had some kind of access / login to the administrator system so could get my specific details directly in no time at all.

Arrangements put in place with IFA before CETV requested.

Transfer completed the day before the 3 months was up.

Fair enough they probably didn't push it along and were no doubt doing multiple applications at the same time but it is still a long winded, time consuming process from what I saw.