Appliance Written-Off

popolou

Hello all

I’d be grateful for any guidance on my situation and what appears to be a stalemate on my efforts with Hotpoint.

The facts of the case are as follows: -

• The unit is a fridge-freezer priced at circa £450 and bought some 7 years ago;
• The appliance has irreparably failed and considered to be a write-off;
• The fault was caused by internal heat buildup destroying a component critical to its operation (the cold air channel between the compartments) and for which there is no spare part;
• An engineer attended on the basis that it was a safety issue and concluded it was a unique fault but that it does not pose a risk to life;
• Hotpoint, on the basis that it is a device of some 10 years old (based on the serial number), are only offering a 10% discount on a replacement unit.

My position is that this is a total write-off and so without the ability to provide a replacement part, of a failure caused by no fault of our own, their standard goodwill of 10% is unreasonable when I am now faced with the purchase of a complete replacement unit. They have not accepted that it is a design fault, nor have they disclosed whether it is a common fault but have accepted that it is a unique fault. Irrespective of this, they are refusing to come up from the standard basis of remuneration solely based on its age. I disagree with the age issue, without entering into a debate of what is the acceptable life of a device.

I am heavily invested in this problem as I had purchased three of these appliances from new, with the potential that the same irreparable fault may occur on the other two.

Hotpoint have explained that even if a complaint is lodged, their Concessions team will refuse to go above and beyond the standard level, nor provide a similarly aged & refurbished unit or provide an alternative solution. Any complaint will likely be used for internal purposes rather than securing a favourable outcome.

Before I approach the ombudsman, if anyone has had similar experience or could suggest a route I have not explored or even to suggest that in their considered opinion, this is not a battle worth having, I’d be very grateful.

Cheers
Pops

user1977

Why would Hotpoint be liable at all (unless you bought directly from them)? It's the retailer against whom you have statutory rights - but those will have expired after (at most) six years from purchase anyway.

I would take the offer and run, I can't see that you're entitled to anything.

Also - you bought three of them? Is this a consumer purchase or are you a business?

popolou

Yes, I do accept that - i've taken the view that there is a possible defect here albeit perhaps not a common one being the age of the unit. But conversely, it should not have failed in this period of time. It could also be rotten luck of course.

Bought as a private landlord, not as part of a business.

Cheers
Pops

Aylesbury_Duck

popolou said:

Hello all

I’d be grateful for any guidance on my situation and what appears to be a stalemate on my efforts with Hotpoint.

The facts of the case are as follows: -

• The unit is a fridge-freezer priced at circa £450 and bought some 7 years ago;
• The appliance has irreparably failed and considered to be a write-off;
• The fault was caused by internal heat buildup destroying a component critical to its operation (the cold air channel between the compartments) and for which there is no spare part;
• An engineer attended on the basis that it was a safety issue and concluded it was a unique fault but that it does not pose a risk to life;
• Hotpoint, on the basis that it is a device of some 10 years old (based on the serial number), are only offering a 10% discount on a replacement unit.

My position is that this is a total write-off and so without the ability to provide a replacement part, of a failure caused by no fault of our own, their standard goodwill of 10% is unreasonable when I am now faced with the purchase of a complete replacement unit. They have not accepted that it is a design fault, nor have they disclosed whether it is a common fault but have accepted that it is a unique fault. Irrespective of this, they are refusing to come up from the standard basis of remuneration solely based on its age. I disagree with the age issue, without entering into a debate of what is the acceptable life of a device.

I am heavily invested in this problem as I had purchased three of these appliances from new, with the potential that the same irreparable fault may occur on the other two.

Hotpoint have explained that even if a complaint is lodged, their Concessions team will refuse to go above and beyond the standard level, nor provide a similarly aged & refurbished unit or provide an alternative solution. Any complaint will likely be used for internal purposes rather than securing a favourable outcome.

Before I approach the ombudsman, if anyone has had similar experience or could suggest a route I have not explored or even to suggest that in their considered opinion, this is not a battle worth having, I’d be very grateful.

Cheers
Pops

A few points and queries here, pertaining to the highlighted sections:

Seven years is a long time ago.  Granted, I'd expect a fridge/freezer to last longer than that, but perhaps it's not an unreasonable lifespan.

The fault is proven, but there seems to be some debate about whether it's inherent, i.e. a design flaw present at the time of purchase that meant premature failure was inevitable.  From your description I'm not convinced it is a design flaw (surely it would have failed much sooner), nor that failure after seven years is considered premature (see my first point.

You're not entitled to a full refund of course.  Who did you buy it from?  Hotpoint directly?  If not, then any consumer rights lie with the retailer, e.g. Currys, AO, John Lewis and anything Hotpoint is offering is only goodwill unless it's some sort of warranty claim.  Taking Hotpoint to an ombudsman or court is pointless if they didn't sell it to you.

Why did you buy three fridge-freezers?  Are they for an office or rental properties, for example?  If so, then you don't have consumer rights anyway, because you bought them for business purposes.

Personally, getting £45 back on a £450 seven year-old appliance is a pretty good deal.  Better if it was cash rather than a discount on a new unit, but presumably you do need a new unit? 

Aylesbury_Duck

popolou said:

Yes, I do accept that - i've taken the view that there is a possible defect here albeit perhaps not a common one being the age of the unit. But conversely, it should not have failed in this period of time. It could also be rotten luck of course.

Bought as a private landlord, not as part of a business.

Cheers
Pops

Cross-posted with me.  This was a B2B sale, then.  You don't have normal consumer rights, but you would be covered under the SOGA.  I don't think that makes any difference, though - if Hotpoint wasn't the retailer they're not obliged to help you at all, and if they were, what they're offering seems more than reasonable.

popolou

Understood and my thanks to you both for your respective input. I suspect the argument would be somewhat the same under the SOGA and proving that the fault was there at the start is the hurdle.

I did suspect I’d have to take the hit on this.

Thanks again

Pops

DullGreyGuy

What are the terms and duration of the warranty?

Your "rights", if you had any given its for the purposes of being a landlord, would be with the retailer and would have expired when you passed the 6th anniversary of the purchase. 

Ultimately if you make enough of a pain of yourself a company may always give in to just get rid of you but outside of that you are onto a loser. Even the new legislation on spare parts legally having to be available is capped at 7 years from when manufacturing ceased... you bought it at 3 years old so potentially there would have only been 4 years left of that requirement even if had applied back then (but its naturally only forward looking)

Time to workout if it's cheaper to buy from them with the 10% off or buy it elsewhere on sale. 

popolou

DullGreyGuy said:

What are the terms and duration of the warranty?

Your "rights", if you had any given its for the purposes of being a landlord, would be with the retailer and would have expired when you passed the 6th anniversary of the purchase. 

Ultimately if you make enough of a pain of yourself a company may always give in to just get rid of you but outside of that you are onto a loser. Even the new legislation on spare parts legally having to be available is capped at 7 years from when manufacturing ceased... you bought it at 3 years old so potentially there would have only been 4 years left of that requirement even if had applied back then (but its naturally only forward looking)

Time to workout if it's cheaper to buy from them with the 10% off or buy it elsewhere on sale. 

Hi

No warranty beyond the standard one year in this case. Was bought new and part of the reason why i have pushed this as far as i could with them in case i should have the same occur quite soon with the other two. Must be a fringe case where it's none of the serviceable parts have failed or ever had a chance to fail...frustratingly.

Cheers
Pops

Okell

popolou said:

Understood and my thanks to you both for your respective input. I suspect the argument would be somewhat the same under the SOGA and proving that the fault was there at the start is the hurdle.

I did suspect I’d have to take the hit on this.

Thanks again

Pops

No - the primary hurdle is that you bought them over 6 years ago.

s5 of the Limitation Act 1980 (legislation.gov.uk) prevents you from suing somebody for breach of contract after 6 years have expired from the cause of action accruing.  Even if you could show that the fault was "present" at purchase, any claim against the retailer would be statute barred.