Octopus Energy Simply Ripping Customers Off

born_again

MP1995 said:

If they have 7mln customers and make £700 per year off each of them and then refund them, the interest they are making is staggering at 4%, £196mln

To clear this up energy suppliers do not earn interest on any customer credits.

Which are also a month in arrears 🤷‍♀️

Bendo

Seems like a lot of effort to go through when you could have ammend the DD amount yourself or just switch to variable DD and not have to worry about being in credit or debit.

Another tip is Octopus take Amex so you can get some easy cash back by using variable,  paying by card when the bill is generated and they won't take any DD.

Spoonie_Turtle

Further to the comments saying you can manually adjust your DD amount online, in my experience you do have to be in sufficient credit (based on your current DD amount) to do that.  So either make a payment beforehand to put your account in credit or make sure to amend the DD before requesting a refund.

[I'm not sure how much credit is needed but it's at least one current DD's worth.]

JonGP

In response to some of the comments, in the early days of my relationship with Octopus Energy I used to change my DD only for them change it a month or so later.  Surely the idea is you set the DD and leave it until your Energy consumption moves up or down significantly. 

In response to born_again I used the period November 2023 to June 2024.  My highest useage inc standing charge was January 2024 at £201.42 and useage then dropped Feb 2024 to £163.27 and March 2024 to £108.12.  In July this year it was £39.64 inc standing charge.  If my highest useage is £201.42 and then falls sharply each month, how can my review mean I need to pay £211.77.  Surely my DD should be £210.42 at the most?  

The last of my children moved out in April 2024.  I appreciate I don't have 12 months of Energy figures, but if I take November 2023 to June 2024, the average comes no where near £211.77.

In response to MP1995.  Octopus Energy are a business.  The 1st objective of a business is to make a profit.  Yes, there are other objectives, but any business exists to trade and make a profit, so I find it extremely difficult to believe Octopus Energy don't make a penny of interest on customers credit balances.  If they don't, it begs the question, why not, especially with such high interest rates.  If they don't then they are either not business savvy or not doing the best job they can for their customers as they could use the interest to discount customers bills. It's really not rocket science.

In response to Ayr_Rage.  Octopus are getting meter readings, 3 days behind, but they are getting them.  The idea I was under the impression is I can track down those electric guzzling devices.  Also, when you set the calendar in my online account to tie in with the same dates on my bill, none of the figures come even close to matching.  In fact, the bill is always more useage than the online account figures for the same period.  I've asked them to explain this and they claim it's to do with the bill cut off time on the last day of the period, which is gibberish as in February this year, the end date of the bill we used less than £2.00 for gas and electricity according to the app as we were away and the house was empty, but the useage was almost £9.00 difference.  Even allowing for the standing charge and useage of almost £2.00, it still didn't reconcile and Octopus have simply ignored requests for an explanation.

I believe they misrepresented the benefits of the meter.  Sending a 4th to make it work is pointless.   As the saying goes, if you keep doing the same thing, how can you expect a different result. 

With the app and online account always being 3 days behind, unless Octopus sell time machines, I can't use the IHD or app to track down Energy guzzling devices as they claim.

The bills aren't transparent when there is a disconnect between the app useage and the bill for the same dates each month.  To be on average £32 different, month on month, is not a slight technical issue.

Their customer service clearly demonstrates a lack of care or interest on dealing with issues.  When companies house show a post tax profit for last year of £13bln, they can't claim to have too few staff and their advertising implies you can get a response and your issue dealt with almost straight away, when my experience is holding email, after holding email and when I call, I'm told it's being dealt with and someone will call back soon.  When I ask how long they mean by soon to be told they can't put a time frame on it, we'll that's just a complete waste of time and lacks any sort of commitment to resolving issues.

If what they are doing is not illegal, then it's definitely complacent, incompetent, call it what you like, but they advertise one thing and deliver something else.

zxzxzx

You have made marvellous arguments against all suggestions (from other seemingly happy Octopus customers), why not try a different supplier?

JonGP

Also, tp reply to born_again, I want to reduce my DD to £25 to take advantage of the dual fuel discount.  My plan was to pay my bill on 1st of each month come winter or summer as I was cheesed off always being in credit and having to ask for my own money back as they seem incapable of estimating useage based on previous 12 months.  They are meant to be the experts, but what I actually pay over the previous 12 months, even with rising energy costs is less than their estimates.  Not even close.  To be about 33% out when you have 5 years of data and energy consumption is similar,  year on year, something is seriously wrong, or they do it, to make interest on customers credit balances as I suspect they do, or use it as cheap finance or to help with cash flow.

tim_p

It seems like massive overkill to use something like ChatGPT (unless perhaps you’re on a ToU tariff) when simple meter readings and a calculator App (or meter readings app / spreadsheet) will do the job in minutes. If you’re not happy with Octopus then simply move elsewhere, it couldn’t be simpler really. 

What’s your usage in kWh / m3 since moving in?

Alnat1

Ask, by ringing Octopus, to move to paying by VARIABLE DD. This means you pay each month by DD for the exact amount of your monthly bill. Your account will be at zero after each payment, no debit, no credit.

This works great for people who can afford the bigger monthly bills in winter or those who are able to budget by putting money aside during the cheaper summer months to cover the winter bills.

born_again

JonGP said:

Also, tp reply to born_again, I want to reduce my DD to £25 to take advantage of the dual fuel discount.  My plan was to pay my bill on 1st of each month come winter or summer as I was cheesed off always being in credit and having to ask for my own money back as they seem incapable of estimating useage based on previous 12 months.  They are meant to be the experts, but what I actually pay over the previous 12 months, even with rising energy costs is less than their estimates.  Not even close.  To be about 33% out when you have 5 years of data and energy consumption is similar,  year on year, something is seriously wrong, or they do it, to make interest on customers credit balances as I suspect they do, or use it as cheap finance or to help with cash flow.

£25 would at best (depending on area you live) just cover standing charge. So unless you use no gas or electric. They are never going to go for that. Unless you are not getting a refund of the credit & just using credit to fund rest.

Sadly business accounts do not get anywhere near the interest that personal accounts do.

They do not have 5 years of data, as you said your kids moved out April 24, so on your new data it is only a few months.

TBH, variable monthly & pay for what you use, if you want to stay.👍

BarelySentientAI

JonGP said:

Octopus Energy are a business.  The 1st objective of a business is to make a profit.  Yes, there are other objectives, but any business exists to trade and make a profit, so I find it extremely difficult to believe Octopus Energy don't make a penny of interest on customers credit balances.  If they don't, it begs the question, why not, especially with such high interest rates.  If they don't then they are either not business savvy or not doing the best job they can for their customers as they could use the interest to discount customers bills. It's really not rocket science.

They're not allowed to.  Customer credits count as debt for the company and are an overall negative on the balance sheets.  The way the price cap works, holding customer credit reduces the amount they are allowed to charge.  OFGEM have also stated that direct debits should be set such that no customer goes into debt at any point in the year, and the supplier needs a good reason to be doing it differently.  It doesn't really matter what you think is "business savvy" or "doing the best job they can for their customers" when it is a regulated business with strict accounting practices.

Are you paying (actually paying, not credit balance which is a cash flow metric) more than you should be based on your tariff and actual meter readings?  If so, there is a problem.  If not, you are not being ripped off.

You don't need AI to do a simple multiplication.