Royal London Pension

Misteeq

Hi,

Looking for some advice please.

I have a Royal London pension that I would like to cash in. Royal London have advised that I need to speak to Pension Wise first before I can do this. I have an appointment booked on the 11 September 2024. 

I called Pension Wise earlier today to ask if they have any earlier appointments. Whilst I was on the phone, I enquiried whether I could legally 'opt out' of financial advice as I understand perfectly the implications of cashing in a pension policy. I was advised by Pension Wise I am allowed to legally 'opt out' of financial advice. Royal London have advised that I am not legally allowed to 'opt out' of financial advise before cashing in a pension policy.

I then called a private financial advisor to see if they could offer me an appointment earlier than the 11 September 2024. Whilst on the phone I was advised that priviate financial advisors are heavily regulated and they are not able to advise anyone to cash in a pension policy. He also advised me that Pension Wise will not be able to provide Royal London with satisfcation that I have sought legal advice. (Apparently this particular private finanical advisor receives 2-3 phonecalls per week regarding Royal London pension policies).

I understand that I am legally allowed to cash in a pension policy. Can any advise why Royal London are making this process so difficult? I have had to wait almost 6 weeks for an appointment with Pension Wise, which seems pointless if Royal London will not accept confirmation that I have sought financial advice from them?

If there are any finanical advisors on here who can help and offer an appointment before the 11 September 2024 then I would be grateful........

Many thanks.

MallyGirl

Pension Wise don't give advice - they will explain your options and make sure you understand them.

Tommyjw

https://www.thepensionsregulator.gov.uk/en/document-library/scheme-management-detailed-guidance/communications-and-reporting-detailed-guidance/6-communicating-and-reporting

See under 'Directing members to pension wise guidance' heading, copied some relevant bits.

• From 1 June 2022, you must include the requirements below into your member retirement journeys. They are sometimes referred to as the 'stronger nudge'.
• When an affected member contacts you about making an application to access their flexible pension benefits or transfer them to another scheme to access their benefits, you should explain that free, impartial guidance on their retirement options is available from Pension Wise. You must also offer to book an appointment.You must also explain how the affected member can book the appointment themselves if they decline your offer or, having taken reasonable steps, you are unable to arrange a convenient appointment.

• You must not proceed with their application until you have confirmation from the member that they have received guidance or opted out from receiving guidance.
  

• If the affected member declines guidance, you must explain the process for opting out, which involves the member generally confirming in a separate communication with you that they do not wish to take Pension Wise guidance,
  

Long story short, they are required to nudge you to speaking to Pension Wise (the 'Stronger nudge') and required to have on record whether you did speak to them, or to have on record (usually a signed form) to confirm you specifically opted out.

Now, whether getting this answer.. whatever form they need sent to you and that form sent back to them will be any quicker than just waiting til 11 September is another matter. Ultimately, a week is unlikely to impact the timescales you may see from RL regardless.

Albermarle

There seems to be a bit of confusion here maybe.

PensionWise is a free service that explains the options you have when taking your pension. They do not offer personal advice, although ( as with this forum) you might get pointed in the right direction.

For personal financial advice you have to pay a regulated financial advisor.

When you try and withdraw from a pension the first time, the provider is obliged to make certain warnings ( such as you might run out of money etc ) to make sure you know what you are doing and to recommend a chat with PensionWise. It all helps to cover themselves in case of later complaints.
The latter is not obligatory legally, but possibly some extra cautious providers are reluctant to go ahead without it.
It is also possible that the person you spoke to was mistaken.

Another point could be is that RL are in some ways a bit unusual. Some pension providers will only deal directly with financial advisors, whilst others are happy to deal direct with the public. RL seems to be a bit of a hybrid in this respect.

dunstonh

I have a Royal London pension that I would like to cash in. Royal London have advised that I need to speak to Pension Wise first before I can do this. I have an appointment booked on the 11 September 2024. 

Its not a requirement to speak to pensionwise.     It is recommended you do that or use a regulated adviser.   We have sent several people to RL to do self directed drawdown without advice and not one has needed to see pensionwise.   They do ask the question but if people say that they haven't then RL don't need it.

The only time RL need a third party involved is if there are safeguarded benefits and the value is over £30,000.  In that case you need to deal with a regulated adviser.  Pensionwise wouldn't be applicable in that scenario as they are not advisers.

Whilst I was on the phone, I enquiried whether I could legally 'opt out' of financial advice as I understand perfectly the implications of cashing in a pension policy. I was advised by Pension Wise I am allowed to legally 'opt out' of financial advice. Royal London have advised that I am not legally allowed to 'opt out' of financial advise before cashing in a pension policy.

Pensionwise do not give advice.  
IFAs or FAs give advice.      

It appears you are confused and I have the suspicion that you have safeguarded benefits and RL are telling you that you need advice and are not telling you that you need pensionwise.   You have then gone to pensionwise and asked them a different question to what RL are asking for.

I then called a private financial advisor to see if they could offer me an appointment earlier than the 11 September 2024. Whilst on the phone I was advised that priviate financial advisors are heavily regulated and they are not able to advise anyone to cash in a pension policy.

Not sure what a private financial advisor is.    However, the info they have given you is duff.      Or it maybe that they were FAs rather than IFAs.    FAs are not going to give advice on cashing a pension as they are FAs and their job is to sell products of the linked company they represent.  Cashing in a policy belonging to a different provider is not their role.    IFAs, on the other hand, have no such restriction.    Indeed, that word "restriction" is key with advisers.    An IFA cannot restrict  areas of business other than limited areas due to regulatory permissions.  If they do restrict they have to drop the I and refer to themselves as FAs.   They cannot call themselves IFAs.

He also advised me that Pension Wise will not be able to provide Royal London with satisfcation that I have sought legal advice. (Apparently this particular private finanical advisor receives 2-3 phonecalls per week regarding Royal London pension policies)

Hmm, that sounds suspicious.  How did you find this person?  (web link perhaps?)
RL are a large player but in terms of volume, you would expect the likes of Scot Wid or Aviva to more common and if he is getting 2-3 calls a week on RL, then how many is he getting overall?

I understand that I am legally allowed to cash in a pension policy. 

Not necessarily (in some rarer cases) but in most cases you can once you have paid for advice.

 Can any advise why Royal London are making this process so difficult?

The law requires you to have received regulated advice if you have safeguarded benefits, and the value is over £30,000, and wish to access your pension flexibly.

Its nothing to do with RL. It is the legal position that all providers have to follow.

I have had to wait almost 6 weeks for an appointment with Pension Wise, which seems pointless if Royal London will not accept confirmation that I have sought financial advice from them?

RL wouldn't have told you to see pensionwise for regulated advice.  You seem to have misunderstood.

If there are any finanical advisors on here who can help and offer an appointment before the 11 September 2024 then I would be grateful........

I would say that its next to impossible for this be turned around in that time.   
You will need a meeting with an IFA.  The IFA will need to write to RL to obtain policy details and what the safeguarded benefits are.  If you have other pensions, they will need to write to them as well.   Then when all the details are in, you will need a further meeting to analyse your plans and objectives and then the adviser can document their recommendation.

Many IFAs are not interested in offering their services, or if they do, they are likely to set a high fee to put you off, as there are consequences of overriding GARs for IFAs.   You are probably looking at a process that takes months once you find someone that will do it.  And it will likely cost several thousands of pounds.

Misteeq

Thanks for all of your replies and help.

dunstonh - I am not confused as Royal London have specifically told me twice that I must speak to Pension Wise! 

Moneybagsisme

I've just moved money from  Royal London pension to drawdown, I just had to tick a box on the form to say I was going ahead without Pensionwise/Financial adviser advice and it went through OK. Someone has told you wrong.

dunstonh

Moneybagsisme said:

I've just moved money from  Royal London pension to drawdown, I just had to tick a box on the form to say I was going ahead without Pensionwise/Financial adviser advice and it went through OK. Someone has told you wrong.

The OP has safeguarded benefits and is not looking to utilise drawdown but UFPLS.

hootabarat

It seems to be a lot of positive information on Royal London. Unfortunately, this has not been my experience. they are glacially slow to respond to correspondence and when they do reply the information they provide is misleading. I has taken me 2 months to get them to release funds to a receiving SIPP and even then, they could not pass on whether the funds were crystalised or uncrystallised, so I cannot get access to the funds. 
The level of incompetence on the administrative side is astounding and when it comes to their investments, they have been no better than picking stock by picking lottery numbers. 
My honest advice do not invest with them. If you are unvested with them start the process of extracting yourself from their grip.

All their brochures and fliers state taking funds out or transfer is easy and simple, that you are in control. The fact is the process is long, time wasting, confusing and dishonest. The fact is you will need to grovel, beg, cajole, harass, complain, call, call and call again to get even the slightest movement form these crooks.
You have been warned.

dunstonh

hootabarat said:

It seems to be a lot of positive information on Royal London. Unfortunately, this has not been my experience. they are glacially slow to respond to correspondence and when they do reply the information they provide is misleading. I has taken me 2 months to get them to release funds to a receiving SIPP and even then, they could not pass on whether the funds were crystalised or uncrystallised, so I cannot get access to the funds. 
The level of incompetence on the administrative side is astounding and when it comes to their investments, they have been no better than picking stock by picking lottery numbers. 
My honest advice do not invest with them. If you are unvested with them start the process of extracting yourself from their grip.

All their brochures and fliers state taking funds out or transfer is easy and simple, that you are in control. The fact is the process is long, time wasting, confusing and dishonest. The fact is you will need to grovel, beg, cajole, harass, complain, call, call and call again to get even the slightest movement form these crooks.
You have been warned.

As you were asked yesterday when you posted the same thing on another thread.....
Is this Royal London (ex Scottish Life or RL original) or ex CIS?    In my experience, it makes a big difference that RL (ex Scot Life or original) is much more efficient than the CIS offices.

My honest advice do not invest with them. If you are unvested with them start the process of extracting yourself from their grip.

If its ex CIS, then you cannot invest with them as its closed for new business.  If its RL original or ex Scot Life then they are open for business and have excellent service standards.

All their brochures and fliers state taking funds out or transfer is easy and simple, that you are in control. The fact is the process is long, time wasting, confusing and dishonest. The fact is you will need to grovel, beg, cajole, harass, complain, call, call and call again to get even the slightest movement form these crooks.
You have been warned.

On the RL/ex Scot Life side then any plan taken out after 17/12/2007 is straightforward and easy.   If before that date, then drawdown is not supported on those plans and additional work is needed.

It is also worth noting that RL uses Origo and most of their transfers occur within 3-5 days as long as the receiving scheme supports Origo.   If the receiving scheme does not, then by default, it will take longer.  And if the SIPP it is being transferred to is non-mainstream, then it will be held up by the anti-fraud checks. SIPPs by default will raise an amber flag on transfers that will delay the process unless RL have that SIPP provider on their green list.