Initial Parking - PCN Notice to Hirer

hurdys

Hi (again). I'm after a bit of advice about the following PCN for overstaying (37mins). Unlike my previous one, the parking company (Initial Parking) have taken the hirer details that Skoda have given them and sent me a Notice to Hirer within 14 days. The attached two images are all they sent however.

As I understand it I should appeal to Initial using the "Highview" template that Edna helpfully posted in the thread linked in the Newbies post. That would point out that they haven't complied with POFA as they haven't included the required documents.

I'm not clear on what would happen next though - would I just expect them to cancel it there and then? Or would I expect them to then issue a POPLA code - in which case what defence can you have as an overstayer?

I am hindered by the location being an eight hour round trip away and the Google Map photos being out of date and not showing current signage (as I remember it).


 

Fruitcake

Appeal as hirer/lessee, stating that the NTH is not PoFA compliant and incapable of holding the keeper liable. Meanwhile, have a look at paras 13 and 14 of the PoFA to understand how the NTH has failed the PoFA. 
Initial appeals (no pun intended) are normally rejected, so don't be surprised if that happens. PoPLA is where you will see this off.

I suggest you wait until near the end of the appeal period before you appeal to ensure the "relevant period" from para 14 of the PoFA has elapsed to ensure the PPC cannot provide the hirer with the relevant documents detailed in para 13 of the PoFA.

This is after exhausting Plan A of course.

LDast

Easy one to defeat... as long as the unknown drivers identity is not revealed. There is no legal obligation on the known Hirer (the recipient of the Notice to Hirer (NtH)) to reveal the identity of the unknown driver and no inference or assumptions can be made.

The NtH is not compliant with all the requirements of PoFA which means that if the unknown driver is not identified, they cannot transfer liability for the charge from the unknown driver to the known Hirer.

Use the following as your appeal. No need to embellish or remove anything from it:

I am the Hirer of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.

As your Notice to Hirer (NtH) does not fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the Hirer of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions can be drawn. Initial Parking has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.

The Hirer cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtH can only hold the driver liable. Initial Parking have no hope at POPLA, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.

hurdys

Thank you - still looking at trying to identify landowner as per Plan A. 

LDast

IP will reject the appeal anyway. It’s at POPLA that you’ll win, if Plan A doesn’t work out.

Fruitcake

hurdys said:

And would I be expecting to win at POPLA because they haven't complied with POFA?

Yes, as you don't blab about the driver's identity.

lookbook

Don't tell them who the driver was. 

LDast

Have a read of Paragraphs 13 and 14 of PoFA and see if you can spot the reason the NtH is not compliant:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted

hurdys

Have put the appeal in as advised as tomorrow is day 21. Thanks for everyone's help.

They have a drop down box on their appeal form where you are supposedly meant to choose your reason for appeal from a list - all of the options effectively have you admitting you were the driver and it is red asterisked to suggest it is mandatory! Very naughty!

I didn't pick and option and have just left it alone and it seems that it isn't mandatory (very naughty again) as I've had confirmation of submission of appeal. After all, I'm appealing as the hirer aren't I...?

hurdys

Well that didn't take long - between 2230hrs last night when I submitted the appeal and 0910hrs this morning they have "carefully considered the case" and unsurprisingly rejected it. I now have a Popla code, so I guess it's off to Popla I go - would anyone know of a good thread with directions/advice for this? The links from the newbies sticky seem to go to threads where people had the PCN cancelled by the parking company?

Coupon-mad

I think the links in the third post of the NEWBIES thread go to example POPLA Appeals, not to threads where people had the PCN cancelled by the parking company.

But better to look for a previous Hirer POFA POPLA appeal by searching for those words.