Non Fault Accident - Using Auxillis

cheme7676

Hi,

So last week, somebody on the lane next to me swerved into my car as I was driving and ended up hitting the back side of my car. Damaging my alloys and denting the panel of the wheel arch.

I phoned my insurance company Admiral, and they referred me to Auxillis. I was told that they don't want me driving my car because although the damage looks purely cosmetic, they can't be sure nothing else is damaged. Auxillis have since given me a car on credit hire. I didn't look to much into it but now starting to read some horror stories about using Auxillis and wanted to get some insight from you guys.

I'm in half a mind to give the car back ASAP, because I worry that the 3rd party's insurance company might decide costs aren't reasonable and not pay up, or that they deny liability. In which case I could end up footing some, or all of the bill respectively. The car hire cost is £100 per day.

Not sure if it helps but after sending all the pictures to Auxillis and the engineers, I was told they determined it would be written off as a CAT N (uneconomical repair due to cost of car) - and that I need to wait for an engineer to contact me to discuss how much I will be paid. I feel like they are dragging their heels a bit (possibly to try and keep me in their hire car longer?) and when I called them today as I was expecting a call by now, I was told to wait till tomorrow.

Is it too late to speak to the other person's insurance company? My only issue is that the other driver was adamant at the time that they weren't at fault (even though they 100% were), the driver also told me over the phone that they would "contest" if I put it through insurance.

I'm not sure what my next steps should be and in what order. I've never been in this situation of having my car written off. Ideally I really need a car due to the nature of my work, and not sure how I can go about this.

Thanks in advance

facade

Now that you have accepted that credit hire car you are committed to using Auxilis.

You are liable for the extortionate cost of that credit hire car. (You have to be, so Auxilis can claim it back as part of the accident damages)

Don't worry, if you do exactly as Auxilis say, they will eat the cost of the credit hire car if they can't get it out of the other side.

(They think they have a very good chance of getting it, or they wouldn't have been so keen to get you to accept it)

If you try and cut Auxilis out now, you get a bill for several hundred pounds of car hire.

What happens now?

In the fullness of time, your car is written off, and when you agree with the valuation you get a cheque (or BACS payment). Once you get that, you have a very short time before the hire car has to go back.

The third party insurer will probably deny liability, and Auxilis will have you filling out more forms & statements.

Then they might accept liability for the your car, but won't pay the huge credit hire charge. (Would anyone?)

Auxilis will have to start Court proceedings to try and get the money out of them, and you will have to fill out loads more forms, including details of your finances. Auxilis will say that they expect you to go to Court to give evidence. (They don't really want you there, as you might blab that you didn't even need that credit hire car in the first place, but it is all part of The Dance- they actually want to settle before it gets to Court)

At literally the last second, the Third party will agree a more reasonable hire charge with Auxilis, and everything is settled- the Court case is dropped.

Another crate of bubbly for the Auxilis shareholders meeting!

(Everyone's policy goes up a little bit to pay for it...)

cheme7676

Wow you explained this incredibly well @facade , thank you so much!! Exactly the kind of explanation I was looking for.

Just a single point on the hire vehicle, so does that mean auxillis will demand I pay everything if I cancel the hire car? What if I tell them that I no longer need it because I’m now able to get by 

DullGreyGuy

cheme7676 said:

Wow you explained this incredibly well @facade , thank you so much!! Exactly the kind of explanation I was looking for.

Just a single point on the hire vehicle, so does that mean auxillis will demand I pay everything if I cancel the hire car? What if I tell them that I no longer need it because I’m now able to get by 

If you read the credit hire agreement it will almost certainly have some convoluted wording saying you are liable for the credit hire costs up to what the third party is liable for. This is how they can get the matter heard in court but also waive whatever they cannot recover from the third party. In the old days the contract would have said you weren't liable at all for the costs but then some insurers successfully argued in court that if you have no liability the costs are the credit hire company's alone and they are too remote to recover their outlay. 

Most credit hire bills get settled without problems, some insurers have even signed agreements with the likes of Auxillis giving them a substantial discount if they dont challenge each and every case (but retain a right of audit). Yes there are horror stories of people running up a £5,000 hire bill when their car was total lossed for £600 but they are few and far between. 

If you wanted to terminate the hire early you'd need to speak to Auxillis and explain why you previously needed a car but now can live without one. Depending on the rational they may have to pay up the hire to date or could accept your reasoning and still attempt to recover from the third party insurer. If you did have to pay you could attempt to recover it from the third party insurer yourself but you may need to accept that they'll payout at a more reasonable daily rate than credit hire firms charge. 

facade

I don't think so, they will still make money from the hire you had already.

You actually signed an agreement to pay for the credit hire, but there was a clause about Auxilis not charging you for any shortfall if you co-operate fully with their attempts at recovery.

You become liable for charges if you won't co-operate fully- fill out whatever forms they ask, supply whatever information, appear in Court if required- that is what I meant by "do exactly as they say".(Because that may scupper their* case and they might not get anything out of the Third Party)

If you need a car to get to work etc. you might as well continue with the hire car while you can.

I don't have a high opinion of Accident Management Companies (in case you didn't guess!)

They have gone from genuinely helping the little people who would have lost out to routinely using accidents to generate huge sums of cash for themselves- and it is we little people who ultimately supply that cash through our premiums.

In The Olden Days you would have driven your car round to the local garage that your insurer approved and got a quote for repair on the spot (they'd tell you if it wasn't safe to drive), then submitted the quote to your insurer along with the accident report.

When they approved of the minor bodywork repair you booked it in when they had a courtesy car available and used that whilst they fixed yours.

No middle men raking off their cut, costs were kept low and cars were only written off if they were really badly damaged.

Now they will write a car off for a couple of scratches if it is cheaper to pay out the value immediately (and get paid for the salvage) than to pay for a couple of week's car hire while you wait for repair (no-one could possibly drive a scratched car nowadays)

*it is actually your case, Auxilis act for you, but ultimately it is you who suffered the loss (damage to your car and the cost of the car hire), and any Court case is in your name, so it isn't unreasonable to expect to have to show your face at your hearing if it gets that far.

DullGreyGuy

facade said:

When they approved of the minor bodywork repair you booked it in when they had a courtesy car available and used that whilst they fixed yours.

No middle men raking off their cut, costs were kept low and cars were only written off if they were really badly damaged.

Not sure how far you are going back but beyond economical repair has been a concept for a lot longer than the 20 years I've worked in insurance. 

The problem with courtesy cars are:

1) They are often Corsa type little 3 door cars, not so great if you've 5 kids and need to get your shopping and double buggy in the boot
2) They are subject to availability so you may go to drop your car off to find they've got none left
3) They dont cover any write offs/total losses/BER nor stolen unrecovered 

facade said:

I don't think so, they will still make money from the hire you had already.

You actually signed an agreement to pay for the credit hire, but there was a clause about Auxilis not charging you for any shortfall if you co-operate fully with their attempts at recovery.

You become liable for charges if you won't co-operate fully- fill out whatever forms they ask, supply whatever information, appear in Court if required- that is what I meant by "do exactly as they say".(Because that may scupper their* case and they might not get anything out of the Third Party)

<snip>

*it is actually your case, Auxilis act for you, but ultimately it is you who suffered the loss (damage to your car and the cost of the car hire), and any Court case is in your name, so it isn't unreasonable to expect to have to show your face at your hearing if it gets that far.

You have to be liable for the hire charges from the outset otherwise you've not suffered a loss and have no right to receive money from the third party. 

The hire car company themselves are too remote to claim directly. Just the same as if you were injured your employer may have had to pay you Sick Leave but the employer cannot reclaim that from the third party driver. 

What your talking about is how they used to be structured, now they are structured such that the hirer is fully liable but capped at what the third party is liable for hence if there is a £10,000 bill, the courts decide the third party liability is £1,000 so the money comes to you which you pass on to the credit hire company extinguishing your liability and the £9k is written off. 

Absolutely if you fail to cooperate then they cannot take the third party to court with any realistic prospect of success and so then you become liable for the full cost as there is no court order saying its less.

cheme7676

Thank you both @DullGreyGuy & @facade

If I'm understanding you both correctly, basically the Credit Hire Firm make me liable for the costs, such that if they can't reclaim these hire costs from the third party insurer, they can use me to litigate? And so long as I do what they say during the litigation process, Auxillis will absolve me from any outstanding balance (regardless of the outcome - so long as I did as told).

If my understanding till this point is right, then it begs the question... will I be paying the solicitor for all this? Or will Auxillis take care of all the legal costs and just want me to comply by filling the paperwork, showing my face etc?

It's also worth noting that they've noted this in my Pre Contact Info - I guess if my unerstanding was correct, this paragraph is referring to the scenario I just described?:

You benefit from a Group Credit Protection insurance policy Auxillis Services Limited has with Astrenska Insurance Limited (trading as Collinson Insurance) which protects you either to the extent the hire charges are not recovered from the party at fault or payment of them is due before they are recovered. The credit is provided free of charge. Terms and conditions apply.

In terms of returning the car, I still have a genuine need for it but the idea was - if this could land me in hot water, I'll just come up with any excuse as to why I don't need it anymore. For example another car has become available to me which wasn't previously, car pooling, working from home etc. My agreement allows me to cancel within 14 days normally - if I can convince them my circumstances changed and it's worth handing back. I have no problem doing that even if it means I struggle for a while.

facade

Auxillis take care of all the legal fees- provided you co-operate with them, as they just claim costs when they (you) win (another reason why the Third Party will want to agree on a total settlement before it goes to Court)

Everything has to be in your name as the basic principle is that you have suffered a loss due to the Third Party's negligence, and you should be put back in the position that you were before it happened- you had a car worth £XXXX before, you have its value afterwards. Also you were forced to accrue debt by the necessity of hiring a car because said Third Party incapacitated your transport, and have been forced further into debt by needing to engage solicitors to recover your initial outlay- the Third party should also re-reimburse this necessary expenditure. (or as much as a Court deems fair, (or the two Insurers agree on) hence that guarantee from Auxilis that they forget about any shortfall.)

[I'm not an expert, DullGreyGuy is far more knowledgeable than I, but I have picked this up from a lot of research, lurking around forums and the experience of having close family members who have used Accident Management Companies]

Just keep the car as you need it, you won't have to pay anything yourself, whether you send it back now or have it for another week or two.

DullGreyGuy

cheme7676 said:

Thank you both DullGreyGuy & facade

If I'm understanding you both correctly, basically the Credit Hire Firm make me liable for the costs, such that if they can't reclaim these hire costs from the third party insurer, they can use me to litigate? And so long as I do what they say during the litigation process, Auxillis will absolve me from any outstanding balance (regardless of the outcome - so long as I did as told).

If my understanding till this point is right, then it begs the question... will I be paying the solicitor for all this? Or will Auxillis take care of all the legal costs and just want me to comply by filling the paperwork, showing my face etc?

No, they are required to make you liable otherwise they couldn't reclaim anything. However you liability is capped to the liability of the third party so if the court decides the third party liability is £0 then your liability is £0. If they decide the liability is £1,000 then your liability is £1,000 and the third party insurer pays the £1,000. The insurance you mention covers scenarios like it turns out the third party was uninsured and have no means to pay the £1k.

Auxillis will pay for any legal fees if it becomes necessary, your complying will also include sharing bank statements etc but yes you fill in paperwork and agree to attend court if required.