Cabot debt and late Father's estate

Woodyallen2024

My father passed away in January 2023 and I was awarded probate ( no will in place) in May 2023. 

In February this year ( 2024) I received a call from Philips and  Cohen asking me to pay around 9,000 to an account my Father had.

I requested a copy of the original agreement and a statement showing the requested transactions.

Philips & Cohen contacted Cabot, who raised the debt with Philips, and they replied with this information. This was after several emails 

'Cohen were not able to provide further details regarding the vendor and an original agreement. I would like to explain that our client has bought the account from the original vendor and the vendor did not provide them with a copy of the agreement or any transactions. Further to this, our client and the original vendor has a process in place that means that they can only access documents showing historical transactions and the original agreement for a period of time. Unfortunately, as this period seems to have passed, the original agreement and breakdown showing the transaction history cannot be provided'

I don't want to just take face value from Philips and I have not seen any bank statements from my father's estate to confirm he had any debt. 

Obviously, if it is legitimate, I will have to think about paying. But at this moment in time, I don't know who he originally owed the money to or when he owed it.

I did everything correct and completed the tell me once etc.

Can anyone advise me what steps I can take next please? 

Thank you

Grumpelstiltskin

The debt isn't your but it is a debt of the estate.

Did he leave enough money to cover it?

p00hsticks

Sorry for your loss, and welcome to the forum. 

Can I suggest that if you have used your real name as part of your username, your ask the forum team to change it to help avoid making you a potential target for scammers etc.

You can either e-mail the forum team via 
forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com suggesting an alternative name.  or you can report your post by clicking on the little red flag at the bottom of it. Select 'report' and then the radio button that says 'contains personal information' and put a message at the bottom to ask the forum team to change your user name. 

born_again

Sorry for the loss.

they can only access documents showing historical transactions and the original agreement for a period of time.

That would say to me that the debt is over 6 years old, as no CC would delete that sort of details within that time frame, due to any possible S75 claims.
So if they can not provide them &/or the estate does not have funds after funeral expenses etc. Then you just ignore.

fatbelly

My take on this is that as executor it is quite reasonable for you to ask anyone who claims to be a creditor to an estate to prove their position.

They admit they are unable to do so

Any court would take the same view

I think that being professional you should tell them that, then ignore them

Keep_pedalling

Agree with the above but hold that money back from distribution in case it turns out it is not statute barred. 

user1977

Loan books do tend to have information lost as they get sold on from one lender to another (and often the debts aren't enforceable if the debtor wanted to challenge it), and their response does seem to acknowledge they'd have trouble proving it. So I'd probably be comfortable that they're not going to try pursuing it. Depends how cautious you want to be and whether any beneficiaries would be reluctant to pay up in a worst case scenario.

Keep_pedalling

AnnaWoody2024 said:

I did everything correct and completed the tell me once etc.

Tell me once does not cover things like outstanding debts. For a administrator to avoid being left with the responsibility to cover unknown debt that crawls out of the woodwork you need to post a notice in the London Gazette, however that is a bit pointless if you are also the only beneficiary as it does not get the beneficiaries off the hook if the debt is enforceable. 

RAS

Agree with fatbelly, if this is an enforceable debt, then they can claim it.

It's not clear if this was a bank account, card or loan? But the creditor had 6 years from the last payment or written acknowledgement to enforce the debt and they also need proper evidence. If you were on the debt free wannabee forum, we'd suggest sending a prove it letter. Even if there is some documentation, the debt could be statute barred given the time lapsed.

If you are in England and Wales they can still ask very nicely if you want to pay, but your are under no obligation to do so.  Cabot probably bought this in a batch for peanuts, pence in the pound so would make a tidy profit.

fatbelly

AnnaWoody2024 said:

'Cohen were not able to provide further details regarding the vendor and an original agreement. I would like to explain that our client claims that they bought the account from the original vendor and the vendor did not provide them with a copy of the agreement or any transactions. Further to this, our client and the original vendor say there is a process in place that means that they can only access documents showing historical transactions and the original agreement for a period of time. Unfortunately, as this period seems to have passed, the original agreement and breakdown showing the transaction history cannot be proved'





Thank you

Even Phillips and Cohen can't be convinced by that.

I did edit the text to make the position clearer

Nothing to do with being statute barred

Woodyallen2024

This is what annoys me.
I don't know when or who the original debt was with, when was the last communication or payment on balance! It could possibly a business debt, but he was a limited company?! I don't even have an account number to trace through his bank statements! I have looked back through the last 6 years and can't find a credit card that hasn't already been sorted... 

I think this is an old debt. Will keep you all posted! 

Thanks for your advice!