Should a very sick person keep working - where does he get advice on options?

Dulce-ridentem

Hi - please can any one advise how to get informed help for a sick friend with difficult decisions - he is possibly terminal but is continuing to work as much as he can manage, so his wife gets his death in service lump sum. I think he needs someone to understand his work Ts and Cs for him.

He is in constant agony and very weak. He needs to heal from surgery (6 months+) so he can restart chemo... that's probably his only chance of survival. Maybe it's not a good enough chance and he's right to think of his wife not himself (they have no dependents).

He is trying to work from home - half days only, when he is well enough - to keep full salary by minimising sick leave. If he took early retirement for illness, on 2/3 pay, his wife would lose his 8x salary death in service. This seems a surprisingly high benefit - I worry he's misunderstood something. He's been with the company over 30 years but it has been bought several times - goodness knows what his Ts and Cs are.

How might he find a professional to review the options he has based on his work contracts? Could Citizens' Advice help? or Macmillan?

MallyGirl

A starting point would be to ask HR for a copy of his contract if he doesn't have one.
My husband's company give 8 x salary for death in service with the ability to flex that up or down. We flexed up as it was a very low cost - he does joke that he is worth far more dead than alive. Sadly for your friend this is no joking matter.

Cairnpapple

My death in service is also 8x salary. 

I would start with Macmillan in the hope that they could signpost to other services if needed. It sounds like a wider review of finances/work options could be helpful. 

tacpot12

If he has home insurance, he might  have legal expense cover. If he does, he or his wife can call the Legal Helpline provided by their insurer to have them review his T&Cs. Failing that, a local solicitor might check anything that seems debatable, and might even do so for free given the circumstances. (He should perhaps also be considering updating or making his Will)  

I would expect that the  8x Salary is payable if he dies while he is employed by the company. This sort of Death-In-Service benefit is handy if you die suddenly, e.g. in a road accident. It's harder to see how you might benefit from it if you are too ill to work. Once you resign or are dismissed, you aren't covered. This is why having your own Life Insurance is often benefitcial. The salary payable is whatever is defined as his current annual salary. If he were to go part-time, his salary would drop. 

He should be looking to take sick leave.  His employer should pay him statutory sick pay for 28 week, so long enough to recover from the surgery (less any time he has already had off). The employer might also pay some contractual sick pay as well - a check of his T&Cs should confirm whether any contractual sick pay is payable and for how long. At the end of the 28 weeks, if he still isn't well enough to return to full-time work, the employer is likely to try to dismiss him on the grounds of capability and legally, they would be allowed to do so. However, they might, given the circumstances, be prepared to allow him to remain employed on his current salary and to continue his sick leave on no pay, just so that he can claim on the insurance if he is clearly going to die within a few months. 

p00hsticks

Yes, I'd also suggest MacMillan (or similar such as Sue Ryder) as they should be able to either suggest things themselves or point him into the direction of those who can. 

Marcon

Dulce-ridentem said:

Hi - please can any one advise how to get informed help for a sick friend with difficult decisions - he is possibly terminal but is continuing to work as much as he can manage, so his wife gets his death in service lump sum. I think he needs someone to understand his work Ts and Cs for him.

He is in constant agony and very weak. He needs to heal from surgery (6 months+) so he can restart chemo... that's probably his only chance of survival. Maybe it's not a good enough chance and he's right to think of his wife not himself (they have no dependents).

He is trying to work from home - half days only, when he is well enough - to keep full salary by minimising sick leave. If he took early retirement for illness, on 2/3 pay, his wife would lose his 8x salary death in service. This seems a surprisingly high benefit - I worry he's misunderstood something. He's been with the company over 30 years but it has been bought several times - goodness knows what his Ts and Cs are.

How might he find a professional to review the options he has based on his work contracts? Could Citizens' Advice help? or Macmillan?

What a horrible situation. How supportive is the employer being - is this something he could discuss with them?

gm0

Along with his contract. The policy information and claims process for the death in service should also be requested.  For independent of employer discussions with others as suggested above.

The situation may not have come up for this particular employer HR person (if there is one) before. 
It is a normal but still fairly rare event.  But they may be under educated on it, uncertain about it and cautious as a result.  In a smaller employer there may be nothing much written down about policy and process for this.  Just the policy they purchased and its processes.  And the employee contracts and descriptions of benefits.

The death in service insurance policy may have clauses in it which explicitly deal with some categories of properly diagnosed terminal illness. Or it may have a level of discretion on claims handling terminal illness claims. 
Or it may not do this at all.  It depends on the policy drafting.

On the other hand if the employer "self insures" this employee contract benefit (very unlikely but not impossible) then this is more difficult. The HR person then has a clear financial incentive to avoid the claim - to get rid of the liability if legally possible e.g. by ending employment pre death. Rather than to help him deal with a valid claim on the insurance provided as a staff benefit while also sticking to the terms of that. The policy will have a premium and some obligations on the employer - who buys the policy.  So they have to behave legally to you as employee AND remain inside the terms of the policy so that it remains valid for a claim.  Hopefully this leaves some space for human decency and discretion on sick leave review and management.


I'd start with . 

Copy of my contract please.  
Is there a death in service insurance policy with an insurer for the death in service benefit
Who is it with.  (Which insurer)
Can I see the policy, claims documentation please
Does it have terms and a process for terminal illness specifically.  
Can I see those to see whether and when I may fall into that category
Claim form please / where to get it

Can terminal illness claims be started before death

Quite a lot of retail life insurance has a mechanism for terminal illness. 

The definition in terms of prospective life expectancy is solid and fairly narrow.  6 months. 12 months as examples. 
It can be awkward - if you are very ill but currently fall outside the definition.  Or like to believe that. 
Cancer is very tricky as the statistics tell you nothing about your personal journey within the range and response to treatment.  Good luck with treatment and with the financial safety net

Andy_L

As others have said he needs to check the T&Cs. Some death in service benefits will pay out if you've only been (medically) retired a few years.

Is this tied into a Defined Benefit pension scheme? Often they overlap with coverage for the terminal ill with differing payments from each depending on when they die

Southend_2

If he is a trade union member, his local rep should be able to help him navigate this 

Albermarle

 He's been with the company over 30 years but it has been bought several times - goodness knows what his Ts and Cs are.

I am not an employment lawyer but as I understand it his T's & C's should not have changed just due to a change of ownership. However new owners may have wished to change T's & C's but these changes would have to be agreed/negotiated, and a new contract signed ( or an addendum to current contract). If the employees are unionised then the union would have been involved in any discussions.

Also employment laws have changed many times in 30 years, so some changes may have been forced on employee/employer.

xylophone

Is the friend a member of a Defined Benefit Pension Scheme?

If so, surely an early retirement pension (with the option of a lump sum) is an option?

I find it very worrying that this poor man (with no dependants) should be forcing himself to work (although in agony), just to keep the DIS grant.