ARMTRAC SECURITY. IPC member. Swanpool Beach, Cornwall. Final Letter before Debt Recovery.

bexr100

Hi all,

First of all I hold my hands up and say I have messed up on multiple accounts here, especially by not reading the Newbie thread and appealed. I am going through a bit of a stressful time at the moment. Now I would just like some advice to see whether this is even worth pursuing, or if you think I should just pay.

On 31st May I found a scrunched up PCN on the floor of my car. I think the kids must have taken it off the windscreen and discarded as they got to the carpark 1st, while I remote unlocked the car and ran to the toilet. That same day I sent an appeal to Swanpool beach to help me with at least getting the fine reduced back down to the £60 as I am pretty broke. I thought I might have a chance as I made a genuine mistake, am a frequent user and someone who has always paid for parking there previously. They have never responded. 

I also appealed via the Armtrac website: armtracservices.zatappeal.com . My appeal was based on nothing but genuine human mistake- no idea why i thought this would work! I just told them something along the lines of: "I remember paying for parking on the JustPark app, but there doesn't seem to be any evidence of it in the app or my bank statements.  I can only think that the payment didn't go through for some reason - being my card or the internet signal going down at last minute- and I didn't notice it because the kids were driving me crazy wanting the RAINBOW ICECREAM from the cafe NOWW. My bad for not checking it went through.  I am a frequent customer of Swanpool beach services. My kids go to the local school and getting icecream at swanpool is their favourite thing to do. I have never had a problem paying for the carpark or using swanpool services before." I have since realised that the non-payment may be due to my cards being declined for some reason - as I can see my card was declined at the beach cafe that day. I don't have evidence of the same for the Just Park app though.

I did not hear anything back from them - I know I shoud have been keeping tabs - maybe i hoped that swanpool had got it cancelled for me or something.

Yesterday I got the Final Letter Before Debt Recovery or Court Action from Armtrac. I rang them to tell them that I had not had any response to my appeal. She looked up the details and said that I had entered my email address incorrectly with an extra number at the end. She told me that I should have known to contact them from the automated email that was sent to me. I asked how would the automated email have reached me if the email address was incorrect. I asked if she could send proof that I had entered the email incorrectly. The woman was then insanely rude to me telling me i should not dictate how they run their business, started shouting and hung the phone up on me. I ended up having a little cry and then remembered this forum. Is there anything I can do? Or shall I just pay?

Thanks so much for reading.

Gr1pr

Neither, read the newbies sticky thread in announcements, especially posts 4 & 2

Don't ring anyone again, stick to this thread 

Come back to this thread if you receive a formal LoC giving you 30 days notice, or if a court claim pack comes in the post from the CNBC in Northampton using MCOL 

Meanwhile ignore debt collectors letters, including those from Armtrac or DRP LTD 

Coupon-mad

 I rang them to tell them that I had not had any response to my appeal. She looked up the details and said that I had entered my email address incorrectly. I asked if she could send proof that I had entered the email incorrectly. The woman was then insanely rude to me telling me i should not dictate how they run their business, started shouting and hung the phone up on me. I ended up having a little cry.

That's appalling. I am so sorry you rang these horrible ex-clampers and sorry they were so damn rude to you. 

Just ignore it.  Perfectly safe as long as you don't move house within 6 years (obviously you tell them/their agents if you move but that's common sense, not parking law related).

Read the 4th post of the NEWBIES thread.

That's your stage. Armtrac do not sue people (often or indeed at all) but then also read the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread so you know what to look out for that WOULD need a reply.

No link needed to the NEWBIES thread which can be hopped back to from any thread. See my signature for how to navigate the forum.

NO PAYING.

  


P,S. here is the real fightback:
 
...if you feel up to it, please repeat the phone call, put it on loudspeaker and record it on another phone. Have a friend with you who silently sits giving you moral silent support.

Record everything they say to you when you ask for evidence that your appeal included the wrong email address. By all means tell them you are upset and that you just want to see evidence that they replied to your appeal.

Tell them you won't be paying and the alleged debt remains disputed.

Record everything EXCEPT your/their name and data you state at the start of the call then share with us the anonymised recording.

I will then share it with the new Government policymakers who will be very interested to hear it.

Thanks in anticipation, if you can.  Great evidence. The law is about to change and your recording will prove what they are like. I have the ear of Government.

Grizebeck

armtrac have always been bullies

bexr100

OK - will definately wait for Letter of /Before Claim. Thanks so much. I will see if I can muster the energy to ring them again next week and share the recording with you. Gutted I didn't record this one!! It was so ridiculous. Maybe I will try and get in touch with landowners again too.

Coupon-mad

Please do call them again if you possibly can, with a friend sitting recording it (your phone on loudspeaker).  Refer to the first call and calmly tell the person who answers that first 'lady' made you cry, so you have a friend with you for moral support which is why the call is on loudspeaker.

Then repeat what you said to the rude cow.

Tell them THIS DEBT IS DISPUTED AND I DIDN'T GET A REPLY TO MY APPEAL SO WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?  Be polite. Be your normal self.

Let's see if she is as rude again. I need evidence like this for the DLUHC.

bexr100

Heya, I've tried calling them a few times now, incuding just now, but it goes through to out of office service. I'll try again next week.

bexr100

It has now been passed on to BW Legal who have sent me a letter asking me to pay before Letter of Claim. Is it still worth trying to get through to get this recording?

Coupon-mad

Yes - if you can! 

Ignore BW until they send a LBC.

bexr100

Hey wonderful people, 

Slightly stressed out as I nearly totally missed the Letter of Claim before I go away for two weeks tomorrow and I wouldn't get back in time to reply within 30 days. I understand that I just need to send an email to bwlegal (confirmed recent email address much appreciated if anyone has to hand), which I can do while I'm away, which is fine. Please confirm that I don't need to send any hard copies of anything anywhere, including the Reply Form they have included and say i must send back.

I have looked at the newbies post and feeling totally uninspired and at a loss for any more words, I have just very slightly modified the one which is there. It says that I may add information about why I am disputing the claim - Should I include any of the reasons i mention in my first post or just leave it as this? Should I say I would have paid the initial fine as mentioned in first post?

Dear Sirs,

BW Legal Ref: XXX

PCN Ref: XXX
Proposed Legal Proceedings
Claimant: KBT Cornwall Ltd t/a Armtrac Security Services

I refer to your letter of claim.

I confirm that my address for service for the time being - assuming there is no significant delay - is as follows, and any older address must be erased from your records:
XXXX

The alleged debt is disputed and any court proceedings will be vigorously defended.

I am sourcing and seeking independent debt advice and as such, I formally request that this matter be put on hold for an additional 30 days, in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 ('the PAP').

I note that the amount being claimed has increased by a hugely exaggerated amount which the Government called "extorting money from motorists".

I have two questions, and under the PAP I am entitled to specific answers:

1. Am I to understand that the additional £60 represents 'Debt Recovery' fee, and if so, is this nett or inclusive of VAT? If the latter, would you kindly explain why I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?

2. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for parking?

Yours faithfully,

XXX

Coupon-mad

Should I include any of the reasons i mention in my first post or just leave it as this?
Should I say I would have paid the initial fine as mentioned in first post?

No and definitely "no"!