Sickness - asked to work

Royoftherovers2024

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

LinLui

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Royoftherovers2024

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Yes, just to be clear you said " The employer can't override a fit note" 

MattMattMattUK

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Yes, just to be clear you said " The employer can't override a fit note" 

I think you need to take a somewhat more nuanced look at the situation. You seem to admit that you could work from home, but have a fit note which you are using to take five full weeks off work. Your employer sees that you could work from home and has asked you to help them out. Perhaps you should look to negotiate with them, say that you would be willing to do some work from home building up to when you go back. It would appear to be a stretch to say that doing a bit of work at home is going to stop someone healing sufficiency. With such a generous sick pay I would want to do my best to keep my employer on side, not demonstrate that I was a difficult employee and put myself first in line to be managed out of the door in the future. 

theoretica

It seems a perfectly reasonable question to ask, so long as they accept the answer.  And the answer I would give is something along the lines of that obviously I can't tell in advance exactly how I will feel, but anticipate that recovery will leave me very short of energy.

Royoftherovers2024

MattMattMattUK said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Yes, just to be clear you said " The employer can't override a fit note" 

I think you need to take a somewhat more nuanced look at the situation. You seem to admit that you could work from home, but have a fit note which you are using to take five full weeks off work. Your employer sees that you could work from home and has asked you to help them out. Perhaps you should look to negotiate with them, say that you would be willing to do some work from home building up to when you go back. It would appear to be a stretch to say that doing a bit of work at home is going to stop someone healing sufficiency. With such a generous sick pay I would want to do my best to keep my employer on side, not demonstrate that I was a difficult employee and put myself first in line to be managed out of the door in the future. 

I have not stated the nature of my operation and have also not stated anywhere that I am fit to work from home.

There are a lot of assumptions in your statement, many that are inaccurate.

MattMattMattUK

Royoftherovers2024 said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Yes, just to be clear you said " The employer can't override a fit note" 

I think you need to take a somewhat more nuanced look at the situation. You seem to admit that you could work from home, but have a fit note which you are using to take five full weeks off work. Your employer sees that you could work from home and has asked you to help them out. Perhaps you should look to negotiate with them, say that you would be willing to do some work from home building up to when you go back. It would appear to be a stretch to say that doing a bit of work at home is going to stop someone healing sufficiency. With such a generous sick pay I would want to do my best to keep my employer on side, not demonstrate that I was a difficult employee and put myself first in line to be managed out of the door in the future. 

I have not stated the nature of my operation and have also not stated anywhere that I am fit to work from home.

You have not, but reading between the lines between what you have said it does come across that you could work from home but are not willing to. What one also has to factor in is that those recovering from surgery rarely go from entirely unfit to work for a period of five weeks to fully back to the office after five weeks and one day, there will be a transitionary period. I very much doubt your employer is expecting you to start working from home the day after surgery, equally it may be of great assistance to them if you would agree to do a couple of hours a day in the third week, a few more in the fourth and fifth week before coming back to work full time at the start of the sixth week. 

Royoftherovers2024 said:

There are a lot of assumptions in your statement, many that are inaccurate.

There is one assumption, that you will not magically fully recover at the end of week five, but that it will be a gradual process starting in week one and getting better over time, that will lead to potentially being able to do some work from home, that is not an inaccurate assumption. 

born_again

Do you feel you could do a couple of hours a day at home? Certainly would not be doing full time.

Personally that is the way I would look at it.

Royoftherovers2024

MattMattMattUK said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

LinLui said:

Royoftherovers2024 said:

gwynlas said:

What do you think? In small teams someone being off sick for a long period puts a lot of strain on others particularly as we approach summer holidays. To me it would depend on nature of operation and provision of sick pay. Technically the employer cannot override your  fit note but you could negociate for suitable recompense. 
If it is was a major operation with follow up just say no.

I think whilst someone is on a fit note, they should be left to recover and not be felt to be pressurised into returning to work in any capacity until either the GP feels they have recovered or the employee feels they have recovered.

It is not a employees role to think about the running of a business, recovery should be the only concern.

You have answered my question really, if a GP cannot be disregarded/override that is fine. Thank you for confirming what I already was thinking.

The employer can't override a fit note, but fit notes are also clear that they are advisory, and that you can work / return to work when you wish. It is entirely up to you whether you feel able to work or want to work. I have done so - I worked from home part-time twice after surgery. But I was fit enough to do so, and was under no pressure to do so. That said, it definitely helped when it came to sickness absence processes because they discounted the entire period (one of them was 3 months and the other 9 weeks) because I had done so. There can be benefits to "scratching each others backs" - would it be of benefit to you in any way?

Thanks for that, it would not be of any benefit for me no but understand your situation and why it was for you. My fit note states "You are not fit for work".

They all say that! That is kind of the point. They then say something along the lines of "you may be fit for work if..." (I can't quite recall the exact wording) and I have yet to meet the doctor who fills that bit in unless you actually ask them to. 

I have / had full pay but like Brie, I would probably have gone insane anyway if I hadn't done something - there's only so long you can read or watch TV before you crawl up the walls. 

Does your employer not have any sickness monitoring process - that's very unusual these days. Not being in it can be handy if they do - one never knows what the future can bring.

They all say that as well as you may be fit for work taking account of the following advice.

The point was made above by someone that if it is ticked as "you are not fit for work" they can't force anyone back to work.

Sickness policy disregards operations which are planned sickness, full pay as well so no incentive to go back and put myself at risk of not healing sufficiently.

That's a remarkably generous sickness policy. Lucky you. Planned or not, ours is all sickness. But I did say that you can't be forced back - I wasn't suggesting that at all. Simply that there can be some benefits.

Yes, just to be clear you said " The employer can't override a fit note" 

I think you need to take a somewhat more nuanced look at the situation. You seem to admit that you could work from home, but have a fit note which you are using to take five full weeks off work. Your employer sees that you could work from home and has asked you to help them out. Perhaps you should look to negotiate with them, say that you would be willing to do some work from home building up to when you go back. It would appear to be a stretch to say that doing a bit of work at home is going to stop someone healing sufficiency. With such a generous sick pay I would want to do my best to keep my employer on side, not demonstrate that I was a difficult employee and put myself first in line to be managed out of the door in the future. 

I have not stated the nature of my operation and have also not stated anywhere that I am fit to work from home.

You have not, but reading between the lines between what you have said it does come across that you could work from home but are not willing to. What one also has to factor in is that those recovering from surgery rarely go from entirely unfit to work for a period of five weeks to fully back to the office after five weeks and one day, there will be a transitionary period. I very much doubt your employer is expecting you to start working from home the day after surgery, equally it may be of great assistance to them if you would agree to do a couple of hours a day in the third week, a few more in the fourth and fifth week before coming back to work full time at the start of the sixth week. 

Royoftherovers2024 said:

There are a lot of assumptions in your statement, many that are inaccurate.

There is one assumption, that you will not magically fully recover at the end of week five, but that it will be a gradual process starting in week one and getting better over time, that will lead to potentially being able to do some work from home, that is not an inaccurate assumption. 

Who said I would fully recover end of week 5? 

Royoftherovers2024

Brie said:

You might feel well enough for a phased return to work and so log on at home and do an hour each day catching up on emails.   Then in week 2 be able to do 2 hours, week 3, 3 hours etc.  But only if this works for you.

If you are flat on your back and told not to move then you shouldn't be sitting at a computer typing.  If you are able to sit and use a computer without any issues you might consider it.  I did when off because while I couldn't walk or drive and so couldn't get to the office I could sit in one spot and do some things in a leisurely fashion.  6 weeks of sitting and watching a box set of Glee or BBT was just too boring for me.  

Thanks, we will see how time heals. 

Flat on your back/reclined is not a position suitable for computer typing as you quite rightly say.