Full land search not available in Hackney, should I put down a new offer?

user1977

BraveLuna said:

AskAsk said:

If your solicitor says that that indemnity insurance is good enough, then there is no reason the seller would accept a reduction.  You say the problem has been ongoing since 2020.  Do you know how many properties have been sold in Hackney over the last 4 years??  Do you think everyone asked for a reduction because of the cyber attack? 

Life hasn't stood still for the borough, properties have been selling despite this issue, so I can't see how you can convince the seller to agree a reduction for this issue when everyone else is not worried about it.

Do you know how many have not bought properties in Hackney over the last 4 years because of this issue??

Do you know of anyone who has not bought property because of this issue? Even if such an attitude were widespread then it would obviously show up in prices. In which case the seller's argument might be that it's already priced in to the comparable property values...

BraveLuna

BarelySentientAI said:

BraveLuna said:

 I see it as reasonable to reconsider the price to account for the risk of current issues affecting the property's value in the future (and that I have no way of knowing about now).

Yes, you can reconsider the price any time you fancy.  The seller doesn't have to agree to any of it though - and how many sellers would agree to a lower price based on something that nobody knows about but you have decided might exist based on zero evidence?

So you think that having a full search or not having one is the same thing?
The seller also has zero evidence that the property is issue free since the data is just not available.

I can withdraw the offer and they can find a buyer who is happy to take the risk, or I can give the seller the option to accept a different offer (the property has been on the market for 5 months before my offer, who knows maybe for the same issue?, so they might sell it for lower to someone else anyway, not my problem but I have the right to buy only if I feel comfortable with the risks).

BarelySentientAI

BraveLuna said:

BarelySentientAI said:

BraveLuna said:

 I see it as reasonable to reconsider the price to account for the risk of current issues affecting the property's value in the future (and that I have no way of knowing about now).

Yes, you can reconsider the price any time you fancy.  The seller doesn't have to agree to any of it though - and how many sellers would agree to a lower price based on something that nobody knows about but you have decided might exist based on zero evidence?

So you think that having a full search or not having one is the same thing?

No.  But that information was available to you at the time of making your offer, so should have been priced in then.

Don't act as if you are doing the seller a favour with your magnanimity.  Nothing has actually changed since you offered.  There is no new information to say that the offer was wrong.

AskAsk

BraveLuna said:

AskAsk said:

If your solicitor says that that indemnity insurance is good enough, then there is no reason the seller would accept a reduction.  You say the problem has been ongoing since 2020.  Do you know how many properties have been sold in Hackney over the last 4 years??  Do you think everyone asked for a reduction because of the cyber attack? 

Life hasn't stood still for the borough, properties have been selling despite this issue, so I can't see how you can convince the seller to agree a reduction for this issue when everyone else is not worried about it.

I don't want to convince anyone, and I do know people have been buying and selling despite the cyberattack. Do you know how many have not bought properties in Hackney over the last 4 years because of this issue??

As I said some buyers might feel confident to buy despite not being able to access full search, some other are not. I also have the alternative to just withdraw my offer, but given that the property had been on the market for already 5 months before I made an offer, I thought the seller might want to have the option of a reduced offer rather than just me withdrawing.

To say it all, there are also other small issues such as the agent saying the tenant was already serving notice, when it turned out they are not (I am not BTL and told them even before viewing). Sure, I could have asked for evidence before putting down the offer, I have been naive but they could also just have be honest.

You seemed to have made up your mind and so whatever answers you get on this thread is going to be ignored anyway.  You don't seem to be very enthusiastic about the property and as you say, there are issues with it.  Then just walk away.

Buying a property with tenants in it is not a good idea as it can take a long time to get rid of the tenants, but if you do want to go ahead with it, then you would only exchange when the tenants have already moved out.

Personally I would walk away if you are not happy with it.  No point in messing around with the pricing, but you can reduce the offer price to anything you want, but if it is silly, then bear in mind that you may not be able to buy with that estate agent again as he would put a black mark against you as a time waster and won't show you any future properties.

BraveLuna

BarelySentientAI said:

BraveLuna said:

BarelySentientAI said:

BraveLuna said:

 I see it as reasonable to reconsider the price to account for the risk of current issues affecting the property's value in the future (and that I have no way of knowing about now).

Yes, you can reconsider the price any time you fancy.  The seller doesn't have to agree to any of it though - and how many sellers would agree to a lower price based on something that nobody knows about but you have decided might exist based on zero evidence?

So you think that having a full search or not having one is the same thing?

No.  But that information was available to you at the time of making your offer, so should have been priced in then.

Don't act as if you are doing the seller a favour with your magnanimity.  Nothing has actually changed since you offered.  There is no new information to say that the offer was wrong.

To clarify, when I made my initial offer, I was not aware that a full land search was unavailable. This is not a common circumstance and not common knowledge (unless someone has bought/sold in the area lately), and of course it wasn’t disclosed during the viewing or by the seller.

It's not about doing the seller a favor; it's about making an informed decision based on all the relevant information. I believe most buyers would not anticipate that the authority would lack the necessary data due to a cyberattack, or any potential issues that could arise from that.

I'm simply considering my options, whether to place a lower offer or withdraw entirely, now that I have this new information. I genuinely didn't know about the unavailable full search at the time of my initial offer (as well as the flood risk that came out from the survey). Additionally, I discovered that the tenants were not actually serving notice as initially claimed, which adds to the uncertainty and risk.

I was hoping to get advice on whether it would be more reasonable to renegotiate the price under these circumstances or to withdraw from the sale altogether. Thank you to everyone who has shared their insights so far.

alri08

Personally, I would be more worried about the situation with the tenants. It's not a minor issue and the EA was not honest with you. That in itself would be enough of a reason to walk away.

The consensus of responses on this thread seems to be that reducing your offer due to the search problem is not worthwhile. I agree, it's not a reason to try and renegotiate and the vendor is likely to turn you down.

BraveLuna

alri08 said:

Personally, I would be more worried about the situation with the tenants. It's not a minor issue and the EA was not honest with you. That in itself would be enough of a reason to walk away.

The consensus of responses on this thread seems to be that reducing your offer due to the search problem is not worthwhile. I agree, it's not a reason to try and renegotiate and the vendor is likely to turn you down.

Thanks, yeah my bad I should have laid out all my concerns in the first post to explain the context. The EA told me tenants were on a rolling base contract, turns out they are on a fixed contract until December and she said that they will be given notice when my mortgage is approved (not sure if this is a standard procedure).

AskAsk

BraveLuna said:

alri08 said:

Personally, I would be more worried about the situation with the tenants. It's not a minor issue and the EA was not honest with you. That in itself would be enough of a reason to walk away.

The consensus of responses on this thread seems to be that reducing your offer due to the search problem is not worthwhile. I agree, it's not a reason to try and renegotiate and the vendor is likely to turn you down.

Thanks, yeah my bad I should have laid out all my concerns in the first post to explain the context. The EA told me tenants were on a rolling base contract, turns out they are on a fixed contract until December and she said that they will be given notice when my mortgage is approved (not sure if this is a standard procedure).

Run as fast as you can.  Forget about any of the other issues, this is the BIG one!  Tenants with contracts that do not end until December!!!  That is the biggest red flag of all.

And no, it is not usual to give tenants notice when a mortgage has been approved.  Landlords should give notice before they even put the property on the market.  More than likely they have had failed purchases before where the property can not be mortgaged, and so they are waiting for the mortgage approval before they give their tenants notice.

Although your original question is just silly, and you can argue as much as you like, it is silly, you have highlighted in subsequent discussions that this property is not a property that you should buy.  It is more suitable to an investor.

BarelySentientAI

Yep. Ignore any maybe and maybe not with the searches or hidden issues. 

There's a very big issue that is now not hidden at all - the tenants.  If you did go ahead knowing that, the tenants must be out, clear and gone, before you get to exchange.

Jemma01

Have you done a home survey? The surveyor might meet the tenants and sense if there are issues with the house worth reducing the price. But lack of searches sounds ridiculous, since you can't reduce the price based off an unknown. Unknown is unquantifiable, how would you determine how much reduction to apply?