Improvements in Shared ownership home

cmbrookes

BarelySentientAI said:

cmbrookes said:

BarelySentientAI said:

Your precise words were "I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it".  Are you denying that you had some sort of say in it?

What "say in it" do you think their 75% ownership should get them, and given that they have said "no" with their 75% say, what should be happening differently here?

Legally, according to your posts, their share means that you have to ask for permission and they have the right to say no.  Exactly as they have done.

That is a bit more of a civilised comment and better advice. Thanks.

Your legitimate frustration + my tendency to be as blunt as possible even when it's not necessary not coming together too well I think.

Do you have the lease handy so you can quote the bits referring to permission and restrictions?  I'm wondering if it could be the removing a radiator bit that's getting you caught out.

Adding a bit of MDF shouldn't be any cause to refuse permission really.

The lease does say "such content not to be unreasonably withheld". 

The radiator was something that was mentioned but it only requires capping off. it can easily be put back if needed.

cmbrookes

user1977 said:

cmbrookes said:

The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

What matters is what the lease says, there isn't some unwritten principle which overrides that. Does the lease say that the HA can't unreasonably withhold consent (or similar)?

Yes the lease says such content not to be unreasonably withheld

cmbrookes

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

user1977

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

I would agree with you there, they need to have some objective reason for refusal, rather than just say we're refusing it because we have a policy of refusing it.

RHemmings

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

cmbrookes

RHemmings said:

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

The lease does say "not to make any alterations or addition of non structural nature to the interior with out written consent". This includes fixing which would mean the radiator wouldn't it? 

BarelySentientAI

cmbrookes said:

RHemmings said:

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

The lease does say "not to make any alterations or addition of non structural nature to the interior with out written consent". This includes fixing which would mean the radiator wouldn't it? 

You're making an alteration (the radiator) and an "addition of non structural nature" (the media wall).  Does mean you would need consent.

cmbrookes

BarelySentientAI said:

cmbrookes said:

RHemmings said:

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

The lease does say "not to make any alterations or addition of non structural nature to the interior with out written consent". This includes fixing which would mean the radiator wouldn't it? 

You're making an alteration (the radiator) and an "addition of non structural nature" (the media wall).  Does mean you would need consent.

But to just say they do not permit it. Do you agree this is unreasonable. The lease says not to unreasonably withheld. 

BarelySentientAI

cmbrookes said:

BarelySentientAI said:

cmbrookes said:

RHemmings said:

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

The lease does say "not to make any alterations or addition of non structural nature to the interior with out written consent". This includes fixing which would mean the radiator wouldn't it? 

You're making an alteration (the radiator) and an "addition of non structural nature" (the media wall).  Does mean you would need consent.

But to just say they do not permit it. Do you agree this is unreasonable. The lease says not to unreasonably withheld. 

Reasonable is pretty hard to define.

Personally, I'd say that something which could be reverted if required, together with an undertaking to do so under certain conditions, would be a reasonable modification to allow.

cmbrookes

BarelySentientAI said:

cmbrookes said:

BarelySentientAI said:

cmbrookes said:

RHemmings said:

cmbrookes said:

It isn't a structural change. The media wall will be made from MDF wood. It can easily be taken down and put back to it's original state before it was erected. The Lease does say that I'd need permission so that is what I have done, I have asked for permission but I thought that as I own 25% I'd at least have some sort of say in it otherwise what is the point in me owning a share if I don't get a say in improving the home?

It seems to me, therefore, that the HA has interpreted your request as it being a structure change. By the fact that you have asked permission. In your OP you don't mention that it isn't a structural change, just 'don't I have any say in this'?

I had a look at definitions of structural changes to a house in relation to non-load bearing walls. And opinion seems to be divided as to whether adding a non-load bearing wall is a structural change or not. You could say to the HA that the wall will be non-load bearing and hence that should not be a structural change, and hence their permission is not required. 

cmbrookes said:

They have said "Our guidance does not allow alteration or addition of partition or external walls, nor does it allow for any alterations to radiators or heating". I don't think this is reasonable just say their guidance does not allow it.

Is there anything in the agreement you signed mentioning this guidance? I don't think they can unilaterally add (effectively) terms unless there is something in there. 

The lease does say "not to make any alterations or addition of non structural nature to the interior with out written consent". This includes fixing which would mean the radiator wouldn't it? 

You're making an alteration (the radiator) and an "addition of non structural nature" (the media wall).  Does mean you would need consent.

But to just say they do not permit it. Do you agree this is unreasonable. The lease says not to unreasonably withheld. 

Reasonable is pretty hard to define.

Personally, I'd say that something which could be reverted if required, together with an undertaking to do so under certain conditions, would be a reasonable modification to allow.

Thank you. If I mention this to them and they still decline. What would you suggest as I'd still beleive they are being unreasonable which goes against what it says in the lease.