Lease extension

youth_leader

I've just got off the phone with my aunt and she told the freeholder what the surveyor had valued the lease at ... and the solicitor has just got back to her and said the price has now gone up to £10K.  I was aghast and she said the trouble with me is that I judge a book by its cover - I think her freeholders behaviour is quite obvious, I can see her clearly.  

eddddy

Great news!

Does your aunt's solicitor know that you're paying the freeholder's legal fees? Have they advised how to 'protect' yourself?

For example, is the agreement that you will only pay the legal fees on completion of the lease extension?

The offer to to extend the lease for £9k isn't binding until contracts are signed and executed.  (It's like when an offer is accepted on a house purchase - nothing is binding until contracts are signed and exchanged.)


So if you pay the freeholder's fee in advance...

• The freeholder might not go through with the lease extension - either because they're overwhelmed by the process, or because they've fallen out with your aunt, etc

• The freeholder might say "I've spoken to my friend George in the pub, and he says that the lease extension is worth £15k, so I'm increasing the price to £15k"

• (Or for that matter, your aunt might say "I've spoken to Bill in the pub, and he says the lease extension should only cost £5k - so I'm not going ahead.")

So maybe you might want a written agreement with the freeholder that they will return the legal fee if completion doesn't happen...

... or even better if you agree that you won't pay the freeholder's legal fee until completion.

youth_leader

Oh thank you @eddddy,  I will be very careful.  I do wish I'd not got involved at all.

youth_leader

I've just had a dreadful conversation with my aunt.  Looks like this might go to Tribunal.

It seems her freeholder, who accepted £9K verbally from my aunt and shook her hand on 28 October, and then told her solicitor she wanted  £10K, has just told my aunt that her solicitor cannot do anything until he sees my aunt's surveyor's valuation report.

My aunt phoned her solicitor, and she said it is not necessary for the freeholder's solicitor to see this report.  It's a stalemate.

I had previously contacted the freeholder who had thought she could 'use' my aunt's surveyor's value report.   I explained to her that she had to get her own surveyor, who would obviously weight it in her favour, and I would pay for it. Seems she did find her own surveyor, Ted. 

My aunt's solicitor then visited.  She told her to cancel the visit the next day from 'Ted' the valuation surveyor, and just telephone her freeholder to offer the £9K.  She phoned and her freeholder accepted. They saw each other and shook hands on it later in the day.  The freeholder almost immediately went back on her word by telling her solicitor she wanted £1K more, ie £10K.

My aunt has yet again has accused me of making her blood pressure go up, I can't talk to her about this again, she cannot understand what is going on and will not grant me the POA so I can deal.  I am going to have to leave them to sort this out, blind leading the blind.  

I am undecided as to whether to contact the freeholder on Farcebook.

youth_leader

I've thought about this all night, and I don't think I can approach the freeholder in this instance.  

It is very odd her solicitor 'won't act' until he has seen my aunt's surveyor's lease valuation.  

I had advised the freeholder to get her own surveyor, and she was surprised as she thought the one she had found to value my aunt's lease was working for them both.  She did find someone else who was due the day after my aunt's solicitor visited, the solicitor advised her to cancel it.  

My aunt is very reluctant to have a surveyor at her flat again, and was in a state tonight, asking what the freeholder is going to do with her money!  She said she will not be doing anything now until January.

I feel I have to leave this in the hands of the solicitors, hopefully between them the contract will be signed.  Thank you for listening.

eddddy

I've lost track of some of the details of this, but is there a reason why your Aunt doesn't want to hand over a copy of the valuation?

For example, is it because the valuation says, for example, £15k - but your Aunt is only offering £9k?


Alternatively, if the valuation says £9k and your Aunt is offering £9k, that should reassure everyone.

youth_leader

Good morning @eddddy, I've had a sleepless night over this.   

My aunt is very confused and  this business has affected her very badly.   I had hoped the 'informal route' would be quick and easy.

I don't know if my aunt's solicitor did issue a Section 42, and dare not ask my aunt.

She was shouting down the phone at me 'what is she going to do with my money'.  She said it is making her ill every time someone mentions the lease and she cannot cope, she is an old lady, and I'll understand when I'm old. She pretended she had to put the bins out to end the phone call.

Some time ago now I'd told my aunt that she should have a surveyor to value the lease, and I sent her some names I found on the web.   

She then rang me to tell me she'd asked her 'friend' the freeholder to find her one.  You commented this was a bad idea, and it definitely was.  I think he charged her a very low fee of £200.

She invited him round and he valued the lease between £11-£12K and I told her to keep this information to herself. 

Nothing happened for some time and I contacted her neighbour/freeholder informally on facebook to ask what was happening.  The freeholder then told me she had found the surveyor, and  thought he was working for both of them.  She asked to see the report.  I said she needed to find her own surveyor.  She did find someone and arranged for him to visit my aunt's flat on 29 October.  I had said it could be desktop, she wanted physical.  Someone told my aunt bluntly she would be paying for this, I'm not sure how,   she was not happy.  I pointed out yesterday that I had agreed to pay her freeholder's solicitors fees as my Mum would have helped her if she was here.  No gratitude shown!

The solicitor visited my aunt on 28th October.  She told my aunt to telephone the freeholder and offer the £9K, and to cancel the freeholder's valuation the next day.

My aunt did tell the freeholder what the surveyor's valuation was, when they later shook hands on the £9K.  The freeholder's solicitor then rang my aunt's solicitor and said she wanted the price increased to £10K. 

My aunt is 87 and thought the 'hand shake' was binding and it was done and dusted as they say.  It has tested our relationship as aunt/niece to breaking point sadly, I dread what will happen when she puts her flat on the market.  

youth_leader

You just never know do you!  I'm so glad it is over, what a horrible time I've had of it.  If anyone else has LPOA and is asked to help an elderly relative with this business transaction, get your relative to hand the whole transaction over to you.  

Thank you so very much for your advice @eddddy, I wouldn't have got here without you. 

I wish you and your family a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.  

My aunt has just telephoned to say her solicitor has written, detailing the lease extension at the agreed cost of £10K.  They are asking for payments to 'progress' so I've just transferred the £854 I agreed to pay for the freeholder costs from NS&I, ready to forward to my aunt.   I had paid the freeholder £50 in September as a deposit for her solicitor and I don't think it has been deducted from the £854, but I'm not going to chase it.  
 

youth_leader

Hello @eddddy, a big thank you from me, it is nearly over at last.  

My aunt rang me today, the solicitor is visiting her with the documents to sign on 6 May.   My aunt celebrates her  88th birthday on 12 May, I am travelling down to see her to take for a few days and will take her out for a special lunch.

Her solicitor asked for the funds for the freeholder's solicitor on 15 December and I sent them immediately, my aunt posted them a cheque by first class post.    

No idea why she has had to wait so long, but very glad she can now go on the market and hopefully a place will come up at the assisted living.  I won't be getting involved with the sale at all after this horrible experience, I'll leave it to the trusted neighbour.  

youth_leader

Hello again  @edddy, I had a call earlier in the week from my aunt, she was very upset.

Her solicitor cancelled the 6 May due to sickness, and visited her on 9 May instead.  She signed the 'contract', and wrote out the cheque for £10K.  I had already sent the freeholder's solicitor's fees in December.  I went down to the IOW for the weekend of 10/11th May to see her and we had a pleasant birthday lunch with her neighbour.

The solicitor told my aunt the paperwork now had to go to Land Registry.

Most unfortunately her neighbour/freeholder is losing her job as a teacher due to the school closing. 
She phones my aunt a few times a week, and during the call this week she expressed her disappointment at the 'wait' for the money. 

Thank you, I now know that LR is not involved in the payment procedure to the freeholder.

(Is there any way I can find out how long the lease will be at Land Registry please?)