Electricity Tariff and bank direct debits.

ClumsyHorse

Six months ago we contracted with British Gas for Exclusive Fixed Energy v30 Tariff for one year, to end in November 2024. Our historical electricity consumption was declared, agreed, contracted. Monthly Bank Direct Debits were agreed and have all been paid correctly at the agreed monthly amount. We submit meter readings once a month when British Gas requests. Our meter readings currently show our consumption of electricity to be somewhat lower than was declared, agreed, and contracted. We got an email recently from BG saying we do not need to keep submitting meter readings "because you have a Fixed Tariff".  The very next day (yesterday) we got an email from BG saying "You have to submit a meter reading now". And in the same email it said "Your monthly Direct Debits will increase as of next bill in April 2024...." and the figure amounted to a 42% increase. Questions: Is it legitimate for BG to increase my monthly Direct Debits when we have a Fixed Tariff, and when our consumption is actually lower than was predicted, agreed, contracted, six months ago, and when our contracted period still has another six months before it ends? Surely BG must be making a mistake? Their email also says "We need to discuss your current energy usage, existing direct debit payments and submit a current meter reading to bill your account. To do this please contact our Live Chat".  Why on earth do they want another meter reading when they requested one yesterday after telling me the day before that they do not need me to send any more! And why do they want to "discuss" my electricity usage - they have received numerous  meter readings from me since the current contract was started and they show my consumption to be somewhat lower than it had been calculated, agreed, contracted, on starting this present contract.  In fact BG has a historical knowledge of my consumption because I've been their customer for 3 years. I have no desire to use their 'Live Chat' whatever that means: I prefer proper written communication in English and in writing.

Ayr_Rage

Live Chat is proper communication in English in writing, just in real time, do save the chats using screenshots.

Have BG actually been producing bills when you submit readings?

If you are just tracking usage have you been ignoring the daily standing charges?

double_dutchy

A fixed tariff will only fix your standing charge and unit rates, it doesn't fix the actual amount you'll be billed, or the DD you might pay - if you use more energy you'll pay more.

Have you calculated whether the DD amount you were paying was covering the cost of the energy you were using?

Note: You posted this in the LPG, heating, solid and other fuels board - should be in the main energy board (that deals with gas and electricity questions). I've asked for it to be moved

ClumsyHorse

Comment to Ayr_Rage: I'm a very traditional person. My issue is a COMPLAINT, not a 'chat'. I do not want to engage with some person or robot as if it were a 'chat'. In my experience these 'live chats' are usually robots or company employees who are obliged to use computer-style language and one has to type fast whilst engaging in this method of communication.  Using email or ordinary mail one can compose one's responses and  that's how I like to engage with a COMPLAINT.  With regard to the daily standing charges, yes I have only watched my usage of electricity units, but I'm not aware that the standing charges have changed and certainly I've received no communication from BG saying (for example) "Your fee per unit has remained unchanged, but your daily standing charge has doubled" or whatever.
Comment to double-dutchy:  your response states that my Fixed Tariff fixes both the fee per KWH of electricity, AND the standing charge.  This contradicts Ayr_Rage who intimates that with a Fixed Tariff it is only the fee per unit of electricity that is fixed but that the daily standing charge can go up (or down, I suppose).  If the daily standing charge is FIXED as well as the fee per KWH, then my monthly direct debits should be accepted as full and sufficient because they are (a) far higher than they were before I agreed this Fixed Tariff in September 2023 for twelve months,  and (b) I had been a customer of BG for a few years so they have a record of my consumption for those few years,  and  (c) my monthly payments were agreed as per contract six months ago and were to cover all costs including units of electricity AND standing charge.  I contend that it must surely be illegal, therefore, for BG to instruct me that BG intends to now increase my monthly direct debits by 42%.  What does Martin Lewis advise on this matter?  Is Ayr_Rage correct in saying that daily standing charges can go up (or down) in my Fixed Tariff?  Or is double-dutchy correct in saying that a Fixed Tariff  contracts to fix BOTH the rate per unit of electricity AND the standing charge?

double_dutchy

ClumsyHorse said:

.......then my monthly direct debits should be accepted as full and sufficient because they are (a) far higher than they were before I agreed this Fixed Tariff in September 2023 for twelve months

No fixed rate works this way. As I said in my earlier post, if you use more you'll pay more.

You should calculate whether your direct debits are sufficient to cover your usage - if you are confident that they are then you should get back to BG and tell them why your DD shouldn't go up.

I don't think Ayr_Rage was suggesting that the standing charges might increase, just that you might not have taken them in to account in your calculations. All fixed rates (AFAIK) will fix both standing charges and unit rates.

Ectophile

If you want to make a complaint, look at a bill,  and it will tell you where to send the letter or email to.

A fixed tariff should be a fixed price per unit, and a fixed standing charge per day for the duration of the contract (subject to the government altering any taxes or other charges).  It's not a fixed price per month.

If you've been using less than you expected, then you should now be in credit, and shouldn't need to pay any more. Check your bills.  If you are in credit, then you have a good reason to make a complaint.  If you're in debit, then you haven't been paying enough each month, so you'll need to start paying more.

ClumsyHorse

Here is a quote from "Which" an online consumer advice system:- "Fixed deals set the rates you pay for the length of your contract. They fix the amount you pay for each unit of gas and electricity you use, and your daily standing charge."   If "Which" is correct in advising that a Fixed Tariff fixes BOTH the unit price per KWH AND the standing charge, then then Ayr_Rage must be wrong to suggest that in a Fixed Tariff the standing charge can go up (or down). And I agree with what double_dutchy says namely that "if you use more you will pay more", but my records of numerous meter readings show that our usage (though it varies somewhat every month, obviously) totals LESS in the past six months and in the past twelve months than it used to prior to our accepting this Fixed Tariff six months ago, and in fact prior to last year and the year before that. Our consumption is well within the predicted amount of electricity KWH that we contracted for the Fixed Tariff to start October 2023 and to end Nov 2024.  I contend therefore that British Gas is acting illegally to say it intends to increase our monthly debits by 42%.  What does Martin Lewis say?

double_dutchy

When you agreed the DD amount with BG it should be based on your usage, but they don't always get that right, so the DD may or may not reflect your actual usage.

Do you know how many Kwh you are using per month (on average)?

I don't believe that BG would be acting illegally to increase your DD, you have only agreed to fix your unit rates and standing charges, not your bills or DDs, but you are, of course, free to challenge the DD amounts requested.

I doubt if you'll get a reply from Martin, he founded this site but know longer owns it, perhaps send him a tweet on X and you may get a response.

Ayr_Rage

@ClumsyHorse I never said or suggested that the standing charges are subject to change on a fixed tariff.

"If you are just tracking usage have you been ignoring the daily standing charges?"

Just wondering if you have been taking them into account, as depending on your tariff and region that adds around 60p/day for electricity only or 90p/day for dual fuels.

The crux of the matter is whether your account is in credit or debit when an bill using actual meter readings is produced.

Only then will you know if your DD has been sufficient to cover your usage.

ClumsyHorse

Reply to double_dutchy: I know how many KWH I used this month, last month, the month before, the month before that, and the month before that, and all months going back over the past 4 years. The records are correct and are always shared with whichever Electricity Provider I have been in contract with and that has been British Gas for three years so they know our consumption.  If the contract agreement has fixed BOTH the unit fees and the standing charges, as I believe that to be so, then so long as our consumption remains within the contracted amount that was predicted, agreed and contracted six months ago, I believe it would be wrong (illegal) for BG to increase my monthly Debits:  and our consumption if calculated by adding up units KWH over a period of two, three, four, or five or six months  is LESS than would extrapolate over a twelve month period (up to the end of our contract in November 2024) than was  agreed when our fixed tariff contract and bank debit was agreed. Unless we use substantially more electricity each month over the next six months our annual tally of KWH used next November will be less than was contracted - not more.
Reply to Ayr_Rage: As I've stated above, "Which" website states that a Fixed Tariff fixes BOTH the price per KWH of electricity AND the standing charges.  Is "Which" right?  Or wrong?  If both the price per KWH AND the standing charge are fixed in a Fixed Tariff then so long as my consumption remains within the agreed/contracted number of KWH there should be no increase in our bank direct debits, I contend.  I need expert advice on this matter.  If BG is legally allowed to increase my bank monthly debits in our Fixed Tariff (with fixed price per KWH, AND fixed standing charges) then clearly there is no point in there being these so-called 'Fixed' Tariffs, for then they are NOT fixed at all, not even if the consumer restricts electricity usage to within what was contracted.  The meter readings obviously vary each month but adding up this month, last month, the month before, and so on, one obtains a 'running tally' that is lower than the number of KWH predicted, agreed, contracted.  Thus over a six month period you can add up all KWH used in the six months and multiply by two to obtain a (prediction) value for an entire year:  and with our records and meter readings the tally for a whole year comes to LESS than we predicted, agreed and contracted when the Fixed Tariff was commenced.  I contend that BG is acting wrongly (illegally) therefore to increase our debits by 42%. I need expert advice.

double_dutchy

I think we are going round in circles now.

A fixed tariff will only fix your unit rates and standing charges. BG will bill you for what you use and if you are using more than expected they may increase your DD. This is normal, there won't be anything in your contract that fixes the bills or DDs.

Why not give BG a call and ask why they think your DD should go up? If you are correct and your usage is lower than what you are paying (and you didn't have any existing debit balance) then they should agree to stick with the current DD.