Business Park - Diss: E-permit free parking - National Parking Control

Thorndorise

Hi all

Yes I've read Newbies, however (and I'm surprised) I cannot find the specific answers I'm after - hoping that someone can either sign post (but please not back to Newbies as I couldn't find what I was after) - or provide a pearl or two;

Location - Diss Business Park - private land, transition to PPC on 17th February 24
Within park sits a few leisure outfits - namely a Jump Warehouse (plus a Gym & Businesses)
They were having problems with rogue parking - as permit holders (businesses) couldn't park as people were inappropriately parking and walking into town etc.

It has previously (and remains) fully FOC to park there, previous visits prior to 17th Feb were always FOC - always spaces as usually attending at the weekend (moot). No permits required or signs (nb apart from an entrance barrier sign which remains in place now that shows that if you park there and caught in the barriers there is a fine to be released - not relevant to this post other than these are the only entry signs to the park - which I guess is relevant) - no referral to T&Cs on other signs importantly.

Pics on next post in thread.

Parked for a kids party @ the Jump Warehouse on 9th March 24, stayed max 2hr 15mins (no time limit on parking as you now have to enter your details into a terminal at the retail/leisure unit's desk - not clear and not reminded by staff).

PCN issued (as a NTK posted on 12th March, received 19th March means I have until tomorrow as its 14 days from the 13th) - seems to adhere to all rules POFA etc), NPC are a member of an ATA, IPC etc. The ticket issuer (I've been told by the landowner) is an employee of NPC (possibly subcontractor?) - observed the car between 10:26:04 and 10:32:26 (exactly 5 mins 30 secs) and the time stamps on the 2x photos are 10:26:21 and 10:26:24 (not sure if they need to accurately reflect the observation period?) It's the usual £100 or £60 if paid promptly blurb.

Maybe not relevant but both the Landowner (Reads Property Development Ltd) and Diss Business Park ltd (a trading subsidiary of Reads) both have FB pages showing the plan of the site and that the Jump Warehouse Parking Only section sitting 'outside' their coloured zones requiring permit, or visitors e-permit. - Might not be relevant but adds a little to the story.

I contacted the business park, the owners of the site (with whom the NOC contract is with, Reads and Jump Warehouse (where I spent over £55 as well)!

No one but Read's came back to me, stating I had parked incorrectly - I explained that it was an oversight, and that no loss of revenue had occurred, there were no spaces being taken up for 'paying' for parking customers as it didn't charge. Despite a week of back and forth, and then Reads talking to Jump Warehouse (still haven't replied to me) - Reads came back and said they cannot ask the ticket to be cancelled as I hadn't used the terminal on site to enter my registration.

Now, I get the principle of what they are trying to achieve, but this feels naughty....I flagged to Reads that it had been generated on an app and that this could be done by staff on site (which I suspect is the case - can't prove it of course). I also pointed out that if I paid the ticket then NPC provide a 'compensation' payment of £15 to the reporter. I flagged this to Reads suspecting that they were to make money this way from the ticketing, but they flat out refuted this was in their contract.

I am pretty sure there is no adequate signage per the new V9 IPC Code of conduct, and think the case will hinge on this, the timescales since implementation, the evidence I was in the leisure unit and so on.

My question is are there any other elements that I may be missing (other than they are scammers) for any appeal to NPC

Thorndorise

Some pics of the relevant signage - overall the CP signs are ok I thinks (albeit probably too high and the one at the entrance to this gravel CP was turned around - also there is clearly a section for Jump Warehouse customers as well as one of the CP signs next to the entrance to Jump Warehouse - but...the front door was held open for me so I didn't see it! - nothing on the walkway from where I parked through to the front of Jump warehouse. I also wasn't really looking as it's always been free!

Coupon-mad

The 14 days is irrelevant to you.

You can see all their photos by logging in as if to pay (DON'T).

I wouldn't bother to appeal as it's a farce and about to be replaced within a year by a real ADR that is independent.  Sit tight.

Thorndorise

Thanks Coupon-mad, I did think that was the case but was getting a bit stressed about it (that's what they rely on right)....

I've had a real dig around and am struggling to find guidance on this topic - it's weird how the parking is free, if you perform a simple admin task, but if you don't (and I assume this is the same a free period parking), then you get a fine....I tried to appeal to the better nature of the business park but they cannot be bothered with it.

In fact the owner stated he couldn't go ringing up every time someone got a ticket - when I pushed him on this he did indicate that this was the first - and given it's only been live 20 working days it feels flippin harsh....

Thorndorise

Also thank you in advance of helping me out with your thoughts on this

Coupon-mad

Just ignore it, honestly. Do fun things!

KeithP

I'll just comment on the first image you have shown us...



The wording there reminds me of the good old clamping days.

So they lock the gates at night - that's fine, but look at the next sentences...



Ok if the driver is careless and leaves his vehicle to be locked in, he must expect it to remain there all night.

What is also strange is that there are no times stated for when the gates are locked.

Apart from that, who are Oakpark Security?

Thorndorise

Thanks for your reply KeithP - tbh - no idea...they are on the image in the back ground as 'security'. The reason I am showing this image is these are the only 'real' entry signs - there are others that are the same as the actual car park signs (45cm x whatever).

When I flagged this to the landowner/leaseholder he wasn't too concerned and stated that NPC had come and put up "more than enough" signage for them to be comfortable with making sure people could be 'fined' (his words but not on any of the material, letters or signs)!

Bottom line is, I'm pretty sure this is their 'entrance sign' and it doesn't cut the mustard as far as I can see, no referral to T&Cs or other signs etc...it's a little bit of a red-herring but think it forms part of the sites story. Naturally NPC are the PPC.

Coupon-mad

That sign is so laughably childish and unprofessional.  

Thorndorise

Coupon-mad said:

That sign is so laughably childish and unprofessional.  

Agreed, so...thoughts on this sign? It seems legit - but then I was just looking through the IPC Code and this doesn't adhere to it, there's no mention of 'the Creditor' even if it's obvious....I don't think that mean's it still doesn't have to have those specific words per their code.

TBH, having had a look at a few of these on here, it's clear that there is a 'sticker over' option for the first 'condition' which mimics the sites needs...

I am curious though on experts views - text at the bottom too small? all these are too far away from the parking to be legible from a distance....I just looked at the evidence photos too and they're great as you can't see a clear sign from any of them!

 

Coupon-mad

It's an average sign.  Ignore NPC.