PIP for depression

Kirkmain

Anyone get PIP for depression? How do you persuade the assessor that it's affecting you badly enough to warrant getting PIP?

Spoonie_Turtle

It will help to understand what activities are assessed an how.  An overview is here - checked the linked PDFs 
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/how-decisions-are-made/

The general questions here might help https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/fill-in-form-pip/

Mental health specific guidance
https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/how-to-fill-in-the-pip-form/

And a long read but explains exactly how PIP is assessed and the scope of each of the activities
https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/how-to-fill-in-the-pip-form/

Reliably and needing prompting (due to lack of motivation) are likely to be particularly relevant for depression.


Also it's important to know that what an assessor thinks and what the law actually says can be different.  So if after reading about it you feel you should score enough, don't be put off if an assessment has a different outcome.  What actually matters is whether you should qualify according to the criteria.

peteuk

Having been a PIP assessor I would warn you against the stance of trying persuading the assessor, as this can show in your assessment and potentially have a negative impact. 

For a moment I dont doubt your MH is suffering, what I would suggest as `Spoonie Turtle has suggested is become familiar with the PIP assessment. If you can try and make notes for how it effects you in each activity, may be choose an activity and note it for a few days (dont mention the use of these in your assessment) but it will give you an idea of how your depression impacts your life.  Eg Monday and Tuesday preparing a meal - Wednesday and Thursday dressing etc… 

You will ideally have the evidence to back this up, medications, specialist referrals, care or support workers, therapist reports ect. 

I will warn you the PIP assessment process is gruelling and takes a lot out of people.  

peteuk

[Quoted post removed by Forum Team]

Standard treatment of depression is two and a half years, if successful.  With either the last six months or a further six months reducing the dose of medication.  

Alice_Holt

[Quoted post removed by Forum Team]

  A completely incorrect understanding of PIP.

Just look at the PIP descriptors which refer to 'prompting'.

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-health-conditions/claim-pip-for-depression#:~:text=The success rate for PIP,still a very good chance.

SimonFF

[Quoted post removed by Forum Team]

I'm not on PIP (yet) but I have been severely depressed for 40+ years.

Kirkmain

peteuk said:

Having been a PIP assessor I would warn you against the stance of trying persuading the assessor, as this can show in your assessment and potentially have a negative impact. 

For a moment I dont doubt your MH is suffering, what I would suggest as `Spoonie Turtle has suggested is become familiar with the PIP assessment. If you can try and make notes for how it effects you in each activity, may be choose an activity and note it for a few days (dont mention the use of these in your assessment) but it will give you an idea of how your depression impacts your life.  Eg Monday and Tuesday preparing a meal - Wednesday and Thursday dressing etc… 

You will ideally have the evidence to back this up, medications, specialist referrals, care or support workers, therapist reports ect. 

I will warn you the PIP assessment process is gruelling and takes a lot out of people.  

Wow I can't imagine how stressful that job. Surely everyone who applies for PIP believes they are entitled to something, but you are tasked with turning people down! Can't imagine the emotional stress that must cause. Do you mind me asking, what proportion of applicants get declined?

peteuk

Kirkmain said:

peteuk said:

Having been a PIP assessor I would warn you against the stance of trying persuading the assessor, as this can show in your assessment and potentially have a negative impact. 

For a moment I dont doubt your MH is suffering, what I would suggest as `Spoonie Turtle has suggested is become familiar with the PIP assessment. If you can try and make notes for how it effects you in each activity, may be choose an activity and note it for a few days (dont mention the use of these in your assessment) but it will give you an idea of how your depression impacts your life.  Eg Monday and Tuesday preparing a meal - Wednesday and Thursday dressing etc… 

You will ideally have the evidence to back this up, medications, specialist referrals, care or support workers, therapist reports ect. 

I will warn you the PIP assessment process is gruelling and takes a lot out of people.  

Wow I can't imagine how stressful that job. Surely everyone who applies for PIP believes they are entitled to something, but you are tasked with turning people down! Can't imagine the emotional stress that must cause. Do you mind me asking, what proportion of applicants get declined?

It was pretty stressful, because I care for people and was put under a lot of pressure, I quit after spending a night on thee phone to the Samaritans and bursting into tears when my daughter turned up unexpectedly for my birthday.

Thankfully we dont turn people down just write the report but it is somewhat conveyer, an hour to assess, half and hour to write the report and next client.  Turning down comes from the decision maker and in a letter some weeks later.  I know PIP assessors get a lot of stick for lying or applying statements to certain activities but lets not forget they are human and there are som good people that work for ATOS/Capita.

Im sorry I dont know how many get declined. (Quick google suggest around 50% (786,134 applications, 356,810 declined between Apr 22 and March 23). Recent pop up news articles from local rags on facebook dont help.

Just to clarify my first point, and yes I totally agree everyone who applies believes that they are entitled to something.  But if a claimant is trying to persuade the assessor, it can come over as false even on the phone you can tell the difference between anxiety, and someone trying too hard.  If the condition is that sever then it will show naturally in the evidence and in questioning.  

Spoonie_Turtle

"Latest figures for normal rules claims cleared in the quarter ending January 2024 show:

• 46% of all new claim clearances (excluding withdrawn) and 52% of those who were assessed received an award"

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/personal-independence-payment-statistics-to-january-2024/personal-independence-payment-official-statistics-to-january-2024#clearance-outcomes--awards

Muttleythefrog

[Quoted post removed by Forum Team]

Can last a lifetime....is often unresolved by treatments... and certainly can lead to disablements relevant to PIP... in particular several of the daily living activities can be relevant for low scoring points but of course everyone is differently affected and assessed. Figures will not be available but I would suspect a sizeable proportion of claimants of PIP with depression have other mental health problems too including anxiety (disorders).

To the Op.... excellent advice already provided including links you should read and later refer to if you do end up applying for PIP. When you look at the activities of daily living and mobility for PIP and the associated point scoring descriptors (statements of disability) I would suggest you honestly appraise yourself and determine if applying makes sense (i.e. if you think you should get an award if accurately assessed) as claiming and retaining PIP can be quite challenging and so is not something I would advise speculatively applying for. Bear in mind the reliability criteria you have been pointed to above when thinking about whether you can perform an activity.

kkkklinky

I definitely agree with the former assessor about not trying to persuade them...it can definitely come across as forced, and a bit tryhard (especially with mental health disorders)someone with depression(severe enough to need prompting or other help) would have the impact of the condition come across when they are assessed either by phone or face to face. My aunt used to do assessments 10 years ago and said people that attend with a full in-depth list of all the descriptors come across as doing way to much research and then try to convince them that a descriptor applies to them in a manner inconsistent with said condition(like being very confident and happy when explaining why they should get certain points but were quiet and mumbling the rest of the time.

I completely disagree about researching descriptors as it's helpful to determine likelihood of an award. I definitely would advise against trying to persuade or even arguing with them.