Council tax charges

bigburtha

My neighbour has a 3 bed house & pays around  1180 council tax  band A 
I live in a  band A  house that has been converted into 2 x 1 bed flats but yet I pay 1064. Surely the council tax should be halved   as I see it the council are charging each tenant near enough the same tax as if it was still  a 3 bed house  so are in fact getting double the council tax they would get if it remained a house. Can I challenge this 

lincroft1710

No.


Assuming each flat is Band A, then this is the lowest band possible and the council must charge on this.. If you are the sole occupier then you are entitled to a 25% discount on your CT bill. Band A does seem low for a 3 bed house.

amanda1024

Where are you that a 3 bed house is an A? Mine, which is pretty average, is an E! But it doesn’t have anything to do with number of occupants, except if there’s just one person there’s a discount

Mr.Generous

There are 3 bed band A houses knocking about, I have one let to a tenant in Warrington. 3 downstairs rooms, 3 bed, upstairs bathroom (in case you were wondering)  big garden. Band A. Worth about £160 - £180k I'd say. But loads of former council houses were "drive by" banded when they did the initial council tax bands, and whose going to complain on band A?

lincroft1710

Mr.Generous said:

There are 3 bed band A houses knocking about, I have one let to a tenant in Warrington. 3 downstairs rooms, 3 bed, upstairs bathroom (in case you were wondering)  big garden. Band A. Worth about £160 - £180k I'd say. But loads of former council houses were "drive by" banded when they did the initial council tax bands, and whose going to complain on band A?

I'm ex VOA and in the areas I dealt with virtually all urban council built houses were Band B, with sales evidence to back this up. The valuations of these were done in house (rather than given to contractors). There weren't many appeals against Band B but one sticks out in my mind on a rather "notorious" estate. The 1991 sales by former tenants of houses on this estate showed prices comfortably just over the £40,000 Band B minimum. It was pointed out by the appellant that all the purchasers were from outside the area so probably weren't aware of the estate's reputation. Possibly true, but not grounds for a band reduction.  

Mr.Generous

lincroft1710 said:

Mr.Generous said:

There are 3 bed band A houses knocking about, I have one let to a tenant in Warrington. 3 downstairs rooms, 3 bed, upstairs bathroom (in case you were wondering)  big garden. Band A. Worth about £160 - £180k I'd say. But loads of former council houses were "drive by" banded when they did the initial council tax bands, and whose going to complain on band A?

I'm ex VOA and in the areas I dealt with virtu£40k does sound low. ally all urban council built houses were Band B, with sales evidence to back this up. The valuations of these were done in house (rather than given to contractors). There weren't many appeals against Band B but one sticks out in my mind on a rather "notorious" estate. The 1991 sales by former tenants of houses on this estate showed prices comfortably just over the £40,000 Band B minimum. It was pointed out by the appellant that all the purchasers were from outside the area so probably weren't aware of the estate's reputation. Possibly true, but not grounds for a band reduction.  

I wonder if it is Band B and I'm mixing it up with other properties - I'll have to check now - £40k sounds low.

It was A ...

Council Tax

Band: A

Poplars Avenue, Warrington, Cheshire, WA2

lincroft1710

Mr.Generous said:

lincroft1710 said:

Mr.Generous said:

There are 3 bed band A houses knocking about, I have one let to a tenant in Warrington. 3 downstairs rooms, 3 bed, upstairs bathroom (in case you were wondering)  big garden. Band A. Worth about £160 - £180k I'd say. But loads of former council houses were "drive by" banded when they did the initial council tax bands, and whose going to complain on band A?

I'm ex VOA and in the areas I dealt with virtu£40k does sound low. ally all urban council built houses were Band B, with sales evidence to back this up. The valuations of these were done in house (rather than given to contractors). There weren't many appeals against Band B but one sticks out in my mind on a rather "notorious" estate. The 1991 sales by former tenants of houses on this estate showed prices comfortably just over the £40,000 Band B minimum. It was pointed out by the appellant that all the purchasers were from outside the area so probably weren't aware of the estate's reputation. Possibly true, but not grounds for a band reduction.  

I wonder if it is Band B and I'm mixing it up with other properties - I'll have to check now - £40k sounds low.

It was A ...

Council Tax

Band: A

Poplars Avenue, Warrington, Cheshire, WA2

In the more reasonably priced areas of the country I would imagine there would be many 3 bed houses (especially older or council built) in Band A

SabiToth

I am writing to vent my frustration with how blatantly unfair the current council tax system is.

The costs associated with most services that are funded by council tax (social care, emergency services, street lighting, roads, rubbish/recycling, etc.) depend on the number of INDIVIDUALS who use those services; yet the collection of council tax is claimed to be based, not on individuals, but so-called "HOUSEHOLDS."

This does not make sense at all. In fact, the whole underlying premise is the pinnacle of unfair. It is as if your income tax rate were based, not on the amount you make, but on the value of the shoes you wear to work.

I am a private tenant in a house that is a single physical building, owned by one owner, but split in two parts under two postal addresses. My side of the house is a one-bedroom flat, the other side is an HMO consisting of six bedsits. There are nine adults living in those six bedsits.

Those nine adults TOGETHER pay the same amount of council tax as I do each month (less the 25% single occupancy discount).

But who would dispute that their footprint (combined total usage of relevant resources) is nine times of mine?!

Up and down the country there must be literally millions of cases of such egregious disparity, such as families with grown children living at home vs single adults living by themselves, the two "households" paying the exact same amount in council tax.

The reason I am outraged is that council tax is now the single biggest expenditure in my monthly household budget. (And I am not going to go into the quality of the services I receive in exchange here.)

The ratio of one-person households in Bristol, including those aged 66 and over, stood at 30.2% as per the 2021 census. I think it is fair to assume that a reasonable chunk of this number bear the brunt of this ongoing injustice.

Either this entire system should be re-thought, made to resemble a head tax rather than a property tax, or the single occupancy discount should be dramatically increased, possibly in the range of 50 to 75%.

Sabi Toth
Bristol

molerat

There was a system, the poll tax, that worked exactly that way but those that expect something for nothing revolted against it and it was scrapped and the current system commenced.  

The SNP in Scotland said that the current system needed changing, it was once in an election manifesto, but realised that anything other than a tax on those that appeared wealthy would make those that expect something for nothing, the core SNP voting demographic, worse off and have continued increasing the burden on those that seem to be wealthy by living in a nice house band E and above as they have for anyone who works and dares to earn above the average wage.

lincroft1710

SabiToth said:

I am writing to vent my frustration with how blatantly unfair the current council tax system is.

The costs associated with most services that are funded by council tax (social care, emergency services, street lighting, roads, rubbish/recycling, etc.) depend on the number of INDIVIDUALS who use those services; yet the collection of council tax is claimed to be based, not on individuals, but so-called "HOUSEHOLDS."

This does not make sense at all. In fact, the whole underlying premise is the pinnacle of unfair. It is as if your income tax rate were based, not on the amount you make, but on the value of the shoes you wear to work.

I am a private tenant in a house that is a single physical building, owned by one owner, but split in two parts under two postal addresses. My side of the house is a one-bedroom flat, the other side is an HMO consisting of six bedsits. There are nine adults living in those six bedsits.

Those nine adults TOGETHER pay the same amount of council tax as I do each month (less the 25% single occupancy discount).

But who would dispute that their footprint (combined total usage of relevant resources) is nine times of mine?!

Up and down the country there must be literally millions of cases of such egregious disparity, such as families with grown children living at home vs single adults living by themselves, the two "households" paying the exact same amount in council tax.

The reason I am outraged is that council tax is now the single biggest expenditure in my monthly household budget. (And I am not going to go into the quality of the services I receive in exchange here.)

The ratio of one-person households in Bristol, including those aged 66 and over, stood at 30.2% as per the 2021 census. I think it is fair to assume that a reasonable chunk of this number bear the brunt of this ongoing injustice.

Either this entire system should be re-thought, made to resemble a head tax rather than a property tax, or the single occupancy discount should be dramatically increased, possibly in the range of 50 to 75%.

Sabi Toth
Bristol

Property taxation as a means of funding or part funding local authority expenditure has existed since, at the latest, the 19th century and has been continuous since then apart from a 3 year gap (1 Apr 1990 to 31 Mar 1993) when the Community Charge was in force. Prior to 1 Apr 1990, the domestic rating system was in force.


You do not state what band you are in or the HMO next door. There is a possibility your band could be too high or the HMO's band is too low.


I obviously am not aware of the breakdown of your household budget but certainly fuel costs rank very highly, and I think mine exceed my CT


The Single Person Discount is extremely unlikely to be increased and if it were, certainly not to the levels you are suggesting. But a single person household will always pay 25% less CT than households with more than one adult occupier in the same bands (CT reduction excepted)


As @molerat has posted the "poll tax" (Community Charge) was introduced and proved extremely unpopular and it is doubtful any government would risk trying to reintroduce it 

macman

It's not a tax on services, it is a property tax. 
That's why none of us can claim a discount for diminishing services, or those we don't personally use.