Buyer's surveyor gave us his findings and they're inaccurate/exaggerated

Bigphil1474

OP, I feel for you. We have just been told this morning that our buyer is pulling out. Their surveyor did have a chat with me after doing his survey as I asked him if there were any major issues, and he said it was as expected for a 100 year old house. That was a month ago. The buyer has now told our EA that he was pulling out due to a previous subsidence issue and us having a sump pump in the cellar. We were up front about both issues (the subsidence was about 14 years ago caused by a leaking drain and all fixed up by insurance with no underpinning required just crack repair, and the sump pump was put in due to a rise in water table leaving about 8 inch of water down there). I think the survey picked up a bit of damp but otherwise okay. I think he just wanted an excuse to pull out and maybe saw something else he preferred. He already had his mortgage approved.

We only decided to sell as there were quite a few properties for sale we liked and it seemed a good idea to move before we got too old to. We live in a mid terrace and were looking for a semi or a bungalow. I expect the people we're buying from won't wait, as they had to remarket due to their own buyer dying a while back and they've already been chasing us for updates. I think we might just stay where we are, stay mortgage free, and spend a bit of money on this place. Pity as we've already spent about £1k on solicitors and surveys.

And yes, they won't have used asbestos in a garage in 2018. It was pretty much phased out in the 1990's but the year 2,000 is a pretty good cut off guide.

Tempestina

We were similar, just fell in love with a detached (this is a semi) and decided to move now while we're young enough to extend the mortgage term to afford to move but pay it off before retirement. The house we'll likely now lose would be our forever home bar any major unforeseen change. 

The sad thing is we felt this way about this house until we fell in love with the other one, and it's been done up with top of the line kitchen, bathroom, boiler etc. I guess it's possible that the sellers will wait, they were on the market 6 weeks or so with no offers to my understanding so since we got an offer initially the second day the listing was live, I guess we might get another one pretty fast, who knows. 

The estate agent has sort of scared me with what she said about this is likely to just come up again, I'd like to think we couldn't get another surveyor sent round who would be so oddly out of his lane like this guy was about some things but she's got me thinking what's the point if everyone is just going ascribe some cracked pointing from a missing window lintel that was fixed 10 years ago to some kind of scary structural movement and walk away. The fact the bank agrees it's worth what we are asking for it can't make people decide to part with their money

RHemmings

Tempestina said:

I'm a bit at a loss and wishing we'd never decided to move. If we do go ahead and relist, what do we even say to anyone who is aware it was previously SSTC? So much of a level two is subjective. The surveyor for the level 2 flagged the garage roof 'may have asbestos' but it's a new prefab kit garage installed by a reputable company in 2018ish, wouldn't it be illegal for companies to be selling new asbestos roof panels by that era? He also flagged "missing building regs" that from my online research aren't things building regs are required for like removing a chimney stack to the roofline only (breast is still intact) and retrofitting cavity wall insulation, likely done in the 90s - both of which done before we bought the house and not flagged during our conveyancing when we purchased - doesn't mean our solicitor back then didn't mess up but just seems to support my understanding that neither required it.

If I was your buyer, I would feel that what you write in the above paragraph would sound plausible to me. 

Sorry to hear that your buyers pulled out. If they did that without negotiating on price, it seems that they are being genuine, even if potentially misled. Thanks for keeping us informed. 

Doozergirl

Tempestina said:

We were similar, just fell in love with a detached (this is a semi) and decided to move now while we're young enough to extend the mortgage term to afford to move but pay it off before retirement. The house we'll likely now lose would be our forever home bar any major unforeseen change. 

The sad thing is we felt this way about this house until we fell in love with the other one, and it's been done up with top of the line kitchen, bathroom, boiler etc. I guess it's possible that the sellers will wait, they were on the market 6 weeks or so with no offers to my understanding so since we got an offer initially the second day the listing was live, I guess we might get another one pretty fast, who knows. 

The estate agent has sort of scared me with what she said about this is likely to just come up again, I'd like to think we couldn't get another surveyor sent round who would be so oddly out of his lane like this guy was about some things but she's got me thinking what's the point if everyone is just going ascribe some cracked pointing from a missing window lintel that was fixed 10 years ago to some kind of scary structural movement and walk away. The fact the bank agrees it's worth what we are asking for it can't make people decide to part with their money

Surveys are scary to anyone who does not understand them and this is par for the course.  One in three sales collapse. The odds are high.  

You fix everything you can fix and you pre-empt anything else by addressing it straight-up. 

And then you go again. 

The surveyor was not out of their lane.  You need to understand that your house is not going to get a clean bill of health - both vendors and purchaser and naive in that expectation.   A surveyor is like a GP who will direct people to specialists for definitive answers.   A lot of people don't understand that and seem to think that being pointed to a specialist is the problem.

Tempestina

I think the surveyor scared the life out of them with the way he phrased things, he has them convinced if they buy the house they will never sell it on. I think they might have gotten cold feet about an older house for many reasons they may not want to fully share and this is an easy explanation to give for why overall.

They came for a second viewing and we explained our side of all these points to them, which they seemed to take on board while they were here, but have still elected not to go ahead. I am going to get the pointing fixed as it should be done regardless but the worry is that it will likely be obvious there have been repairs and the next surveyor will undoubtedly flag these instead of the cracks. I have to admit I feel terrible that I even went down this road of trying to sell. It feels like it will be a big waste of money to ultimately end up disappointed and staying here anyway, which on one hand is fine as we like this house fine and really believe there is nothing wrong with it out of keeping with any house of it's age and construction, but on the other we had of course started to make plans to move into the house we had also fallen in love with. The agent said she would check with our vendors mid morning and get back to me and I'm still yet to hear.

I think my husband wants to give it 2-4 weeks relisted to see what comes of it but the whole lifestyle of constantly living in a show home in case a viewing is requested with short notice is a hard one for me. I'm very aware of our pets and having everything clean and tidy when strangers come around, he'd just let them into whatever state the house was in when they arrived and never worry about it so it's more pressurising on me being the one more inclined to worry about appearances. 

Tempestina

Doozergirl said:

Tempestina said:

We were similar, just fell in love with a detached (this is a semi) and decided to move now while we're young enough to extend the mortgage term to afford to move but pay it off before retirement. The house we'll likely now lose would be our forever home bar any major unforeseen change. 

The sad thing is we felt this way about this house until we fell in love with the other one, and it's been done up with top of the line kitchen, bathroom, boiler etc. I guess it's possible that the sellers will wait, they were on the market 6 weeks or so with no offers to my understanding so since we got an offer initially the second day the listing was live, I guess we might get another one pretty fast, who knows. 

The estate agent has sort of scared me with what she said about this is likely to just come up again, I'd like to think we couldn't get another surveyor sent round who would be so oddly out of his lane like this guy was about some things but she's got me thinking what's the point if everyone is just going ascribe some cracked pointing from a missing window lintel that was fixed 10 years ago to some kind of scary structural movement and walk away. The fact the bank agrees it's worth what we are asking for it can't make people decide to part with their money

Surveys are scary to anyone who does not understand them and this is par for the course.  One in three sales collapse. The odds are high.  

You fix everything you can fix and you pre-empt anything else by addressing it straight-up. 

And then you go again. 

The surveyor was not out of their lane.  You need to understand that your house is not going to get a clean bill of health - both vendors and purchaser and naive in that expectation.   A surveyor is like a GP who will direct people to specialists for definitive answers.   A lot of people don't understand that and seem to think that being pointed to a specialist is the problem.

Have to agree to disagree! Telling us that we're missing building regs for things that don't even seem to need them is out of the lane of a level 2 survey. Telling his clients he thinks we might be and they should have their solicitor carry out checks might be his lane, but unless it's common place for a surveyor working for a buyer to sit a seller down for a 15 minute interview, he was in fact out of his lane. Now that I know better if that happens again I will be prepared to just say no I have to be back at my desk.

Listen, he absolutely had a duty of care to his CLIENTS to tell them all the things he thought were defective and I had no expectations of a survey done on a 100 year old house by someone who wants to leave no opening for litigation against them to come up with nothing. Arguably though, he shouldn't have said anything to us but hi I'm Fred Shed, here for the survey for your buyers and bye now, thanks for your time. What would that have changed in the end? Maybe nothing but that doesn't mean he wasn't an odd duck who caused a lot of agro for no reason, he disadvantaged his buyers had they decided to go ahead as we already had a cost to fix the one problem that likely does need addressing now and it was incredibly small so he took away their bargaining power with us really. 

Section62

Tempestina said:

...The surveyor for the level 2 flagged the garage roof 'may have asbestos' but it's a new prefab kit garage installed by a reputable company in 2018ish, wouldn't it be illegal for companies to be selling new asbestos roof panels by that era? He also flagged "missing building regs" that from my online research aren't things building regs are required for like removing a chimney stack to the roofline only (breast is still intact) and retrofitting cavity wall insulation, likely done in the 90s - both of which done before we bought the house and not flagged during our conveyancing when we purchased - doesn't mean our solicitor back then didn't mess up but just seems to support my understanding that neither required it.

The surveyor won't know how reputable the garage company are - although the import of asbestos has been banned, there is still a lot of the material about and people willing to make use of second-hand sheets of asbestos cement.  If it looks like it could be an asbestos-containing material the surveyor is right to flag up the possibility.

The chimney work possibly required building regs signoff, and would have had to comply with the regulations.  Work on a flue from a combustion appliance comes under the regs, and in particular capping off an old chimney needs to be done properly - including decommissioning any appliances and hearths - to avoid the risk some unsuspecting person in the future lights a fire in the old fireplace.  the lack of paperwork shouldn't be too much of an issue now, but as a buyer I would probably have asked the surveyor to check how the old flue had been capped off and whether it was properly ventilated to avoid damp issues.

Tempestina

My understanding from research is that removing a chimney stack just to the roof line doesn't need regs, but even if I'm incorrect, it's work that's likely between 40 and 50 years old so bar any possible damp issues removing a chimney stack could create, that we've never experienced at least, the main issue of the council telling anyone to rebuild it and put the fires back in place seems unlikely. I think they were open coal fires original to the house but  they were long gone when we got here!

Section62

Tempestina said:

Arguably though, he shouldn't have said anything to us but hi I'm Fred Shed...

'Arguably' doesn't mean he was in the wrong though.

Tempestina

Oh, is that a natural part of level 2 surveys? I'm happy to adjust my expectations going forward if conducting an interview and providing their feedback to the vendor directly before even sharing with their client is common place!