Trickle Vents on Windows

akira181

I'm getting quotes for new double glazing windows (9 in total) and I've had quotes in the range of 6k to 15k.

One surveyor said that he would recommend against trickle vents despite it being against building regs. He said because I'm on the 3rd floor, the vents will whistle all the time being that high up. My mother stays on the seafront and when it's windy, her windows do whistle and it's rather annoying.

I don't have any condensation issues with my windows apart from the bedroom some mornings but we're good with opening the window after we rouse.

Is there any downside to not getting trickle vents?

housebuyer143

I specifically refused trickle vents. I wanted windows that kept out noise and drilling holes in the frames felt like it was going to comprise that.
The downside is as you said, no building reg sign off. You will probably need to buy an indemnity policy if you sell in the next decade.

EssexExile

I believe that if you don't have trickle vents now then they don't need to fit them in the new windows. We didn't have them but still got a Fensa certificate.

housebuyer143

EssexExile said:

I believe that if you don't have trickle vents now then they don't need to fit them in the new windows. We didn't have them but still got a Fensa certificate.

The regs changed end of 2022 I believe and tickle vents are required in all new windows apart from a few situations. Not having them before, isn't a reason to be exempt on the new ones.

HampshireH

Flats don't benefit from permitted development either. A lot of councils will insist on planning applications for window replacements in flats (some take the view that like for like is OK but many do not)

Presumably to be compliant with your planning application you would need to meet current regs?

FreeBear

housebuyer143 said:

EssexExile said:

I believe that if you don't have trickle vents now then they don't need to fit them in the new windows. We didn't have them but still got a Fensa certificate.

The regs changed end of 2022 I believe and tickle vents are required in all new windows apart from a few situations. Not having them before, isn't a reason to be exempt on the new ones.

The Approved Documents (often referred to as Building Regulations) do not specifically state that trickle vents must be fitted. Part F only requires background ventilation which can be achieved in several ways. Trickle vents are just one option, PIV/MHRV is another.

If you are replacing fewer than 30% of the windows (and they do not currently have trickle vents), then you are not required to have them fitted. There is also an exemption if the window being replaced faces a major road or another source of loud noise (e.g. an airport runway).

noitsnotme

I already have a PIV system fitted that works incredibly well.  Does that mean I can have new windows fitted without trickle vents?

Flugelhorn

I hate trickle vents, in our seaside flat they leak when the weather is wild - we never open them , they are pretty pointless

akira181

Thanks for the replies folks. Definitely going to request no trickle vents in that case. My building was constructed in the 1850s and survived all this time. It wasn't built with the same energy efficiency and air tightness standards as today so I seriously doubt I need to be introducing more airflow.

Finding a FENSA approved installer in Glasgow is near impossible. There's 6 on the FENSA website and they aren't interested in any work above the 1st floor. They either flat out refuse over the phone when they hear 3rd floor and say their insurance doesn't cover it or say windows will be around 12k and scaffolding around 5k without even seeing the place. Basically a "I don't want the work" quote.

I don't know anyone, myself included, that has asked for window certificate, received one, or been put off a property for not having a certificate or indemnity policy. I didn't even get an Electrical Installation Certificate for my property, which was freshly re-wired before going on the market. A bit annoyed that the estate agent and solicitors didn't flag it but not surprised and it wouldn't have changed my offer anyhow.

If I find a place I like and it all looks reasonable, a missing certificate or lack of indemnity policy isn't going to stop me making an offer. Flats are sold within weeks on the market around here. You snooze you lose, the market does so much heavy lifting for estate agents and solicitors, they only need to do the bare minimum.

FreeBear

akira181 said: Finding a FENSA approved installer in Glasgow is near impossible.

Ah... The rules North of the border are not the same as in England & Wales.

You would need to check the Scottish equivalent of the Approved Documents that cover both windows and ventilation.

akira181

The Scottish equivalent I think is the Building Standards 2022 Technical Handbook. As standards go, they're extremely vague and next to nothing useful is mandatory. 3.14 is for ventilation and the only mandatory reg is:

Every building must be designed and constructed in such a way that ventilation is provided so that the air quality inside the building is not a threat to the building or the health of the occupants.

Every mandatory reg in the handbook is some variation of "XYZ must be done in such a way so that XYZ is not a threat to the building or health of occupants." It allows the contractor to do whatever they feel is sufficient for compliance and leaves the customer to be knowledgeable enough to call them out and argue their case if its botched. Not a great system, easily and often abused by lazy/incompetent rogue traders.

If I understand it correctly, the regs blindly recommend trickle vents to maintain air quality but despite recognising old builds as having higher infiltration rates, it doesn't say you can omit the vent entirely. They just say if you have more than X infiltration, the size of the vent can be reduced. I don't see a Glasgow tenement flat coming close to modern standards, so trickle vents are pointless for me IMO.

As for certificates, an EIC is required for selling a house (although I never got one) but I don't see any requirement for a window certificate.

No planning application is needed as long as it's an existing window and your building is not listed / in a conservation area. Going from a traditional wooden sash to a pvc tilt & turn is a bit of a grey zone. They say you need to get planning permission but I don't know anyone that's replaced sash windows in a non-listed building to have problems. Not something I have to worry about as I already have PVC windows (as does 90% of the street).

The only other reg I see that I am breaking is the cleaning part as I'm planning to have a 600mm fixed pane at the top, which cannot be cleaned from inside the flat "safely" as the regs expect you to have both feet on the floor and use your hands only. Apparently they haven't heard of an extendable pole or a window cleaner before.