Chimney breast removal

Section62

[iD] said:

Thanks everyone
Looking at my own drawing, I think I got it slightly wrong in the first floor as chimney breast on the first floor goes right till the end. Stack is also at the end of the loft as well.

Since the stack is in the corner of the loft, it doesn't leave us with much room to install brackets in the loft. I am more leaning towards what Section62 suggested. Although we'd have a little box in the room but still better than massive chimney breast.

I have updated the designs below, please let me know if this seems viable.

I think it would be worth contacting building control and see if they have any original plans for the property. They may make a charge for this service, but it would probably be worth it to see how the original plan envisaged the chimney being constructed.

I would normally expect the horizontal displacement of the chimney to be achieved through corbelling, but equally stuart45's suggestion of a cast in-situ slab (or possibly lintels) is a possibility and as he points out, if that slab goes through the wall to the neighbouring property then you may need a more complicated solution.

The alternative would be getting some intrusive surveys done - e.g. lifting floorboards and seeing what the ground/1st floor level transition looks like which would need to be done before starting the work, but could possibly be avoided if the BC plans show an arrangement which makes total removal of the chimney (on your side only) impractical.

Can you confirm what the first floor chimney breast is made of? Are they some kind of large-format concrete blocks?

[iD]

Thank you. Had a structural engineer in, since there isn’t much space for brackets in the loft, he reckons we need to put brackets in the upstairs room to support the stack. 

He’s suggestion around 1m of the breast is left from the roof line into the room and supported using gallows brackets.
i was looking at the labc documentation that was provided by the building control. It suggests leaving as much of the breast inside as the stack above the roof line. That to me look more than 2 meters.   

Now I’m confused as to where to begin. I have a call booked with the building control officer on Wednesday to discuss this. Do we know if they can/do visit before the work starts? Ideally I’d like to remove as much of the breast in the first floor room as safely possible. 

https://inspectapedia.com/chimneys/Chimney-Removal-labc.co.uk.pdf

FreeBear

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

moneysaver1978

FreeBear said:

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

Unless I misread, I thought gallow brackets are not accepted if fitted to the party wall, right?

stuart45

moneysaver1978 said:

FreeBear said:

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

Unless I misread, I thought gallow brackets are not accepted if fitteitsd to the party wall, right?

Can't be used if next door has removed theirs. Or if it sticks out more than 340mm. Or if the wall's in poor condition, lime mortar etc.
Or if the BCO says no.

[iD]

FreeBear said:

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

Building control suggested gallows brackets. You reckon we’d have problem selling the property because it probably won’t pass the building regs of that time? 

Pretty much all older properties would fail for one reason or another since building regs are constantly updated, right?

stuart45

[iD] said:

FreeBear said:

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

Building control suggested gallows brackets. You reckon we’d have problem selling the property because it probably won’t pass the building regs of that time? 

Pretty much all older properties would fail for one reason or another since building regs are constantly updated, right?

You will have it signed off so in theory there shouldn't be a problem. However, things can change with lenders, so it's possible in the future that they won't lend on gallows brackets, as with foam in the roof. Probably unlikely, but possible.
When I was an apprentice it was acceptable to start building a chimney from the first floor with corbelled brickwork from a 13inch wall. This was fine with Building Control, but you might find a problem with the lenders now.

FreeBear

[iD] said:

FreeBear said:

As most Building Control departments do not accept gallow brackets, you may well have difficulties selling the property when the time comes. I suspect fitting a steel would be a more prudent option in the long term and you would avoid a lot of questions in the future.

Did your S.E. make any suggestions about using a steel rather than brackets ?

Building control suggested gallows brackets. You reckon we’d have problem selling the property because it probably won’t pass the building regs of that time? 

Pretty much all older properties would fail for one reason or another since building regs are constantly updated, right?

Quite often see on these forums, surveys done as part of the buying process where the surveyor has commented on the use of gallows brackets and suggested additional inspections and/or remedial work. Just changes in attitudes rather than anything to with evolving building regs.