Lodger wants a hybrid car - am I being unreasonable?

silvercar

You either trust him or you don’t. Assuming you do trust him, or you can rely on the fact that any theft of electric will mean eviction for him, the car will tell him how much electricity he has added. He can tell you how much extra he should pay you. If there is no trust he needs to go.

MattMattMattUK

Buy a weatherproof extension lead and run it out of the garage, he will never need to enter the garage as he can plug straight into the weatherproof socket. If he does not need access to the garage he could never bypass it. 
https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/heavy-duty-13a-extension-leads/products/13a-weatherproof-single-socket-extension-lead-rcd-option

Add an electricity meter on the inside portion of that, a Tapo P110 would work great as it is rated for that power and can accommodate ToU tariffs to give you monthly usage as well as a monthly cost to charge him. 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Tapo-Monitoring-Required-P110/dp/B097YBXHTW/

It does however seem that the bigger issue is that you just do not trust him, which is a major issue with a lodger. 

Bluebell1000

It is really easy to use the app for our EV charger to see electric use. If you are willing to install a charge point, then that would be a simple answer - and having a charge point may well be a selling point for any future lodger...?

Ryan_Holden

Thank you again for all the comments, I appreciate it.

RE: Trust, it's not that I don't trust him per say, I just know how easy it would be to plug into a different socket rather than one with a meter. It comes from some of his petty behaviours where, for example, he will smuggle food waste into the general paper/plastic recycling without thinking I notice because he doesn't like using the food caddy. It's more that he's quite immature and will do what he can to not have to do the most basic things.

I didn't mean to insinuate he was dishonest in general.

 MattMattMattUK said:

Buy a weatherproof extension lead and run it out of the garage, he will never need to enter the garage as he can plug straight into the weatherproof socket. If he does not need access to the garage he could never bypass it. 
https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/heavy-duty-13a-extension-leads/products/13a-weatherproof-single-socket-extension-lead-rcd-option

Add an electricity meter on the inside portion of that, a Tapo P110 would work great as it is rated for that power and can accommodate ToU tariffs to give you monthly usage as well as a monthly cost to charge him. 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Tapo-Monitoring-Required-P110/dp/B097YBXHTW/

This would be on paper, absolutely perfect, there is a 3 pin socket right at the front of the garage internally that this could be run through, have the smart plug inside and then he would never need to access the garage. And I'd be able to tell how much he's used over the month.

Edit - the issue I would have then is that the lead on the car has a temperature sensor to cut off if it gets too hot. If I had to use an extension lead, I would not have that protection as the extension lead would be in the wall. I know they can get very hot and my house has original wiring from the 80's, so I am not at all comfortable with a hot socket in the garage. So now I think I'd need to have the ring and main gear inspected by an electrician and have an EV rated socket installed.

I don't think this is going to work for me. Too much to be worried about.

Ryan_Holden

And also, so people are checking, he is looking at a Mercedes A250e which does self charge from the ICE. However he works 3 miles away and barely ever travels so he will, I believe, intend to run the car in pure EV mode for the majority of it's life. 

I know we are not talking about tonnes of electricity here, but I do want to make sure that he's not under or over paying (edit - and that my home is safe!)

subjecttocontract

ProDave said:

subjecttocontract said:

A PHEV would not be able to provide enough charge through e.g. regenerative braking to eliminate the need to plug in to the mains. It's called a plug in hybrid for a reason.....that's because you would need to plug it in.

A friend of mine had a Toyota Prius PHEV and that most definitely did charge from the engine while driving.  The point in his case was charging it from the mains at home meant it was able to do a lot of his local journeys as an EV and still have the benefits of a hybrid on longer journeys.

It seems madness to make a plug in hybrid that does not charge from the engine as well.  At least I now know some manufacturers are that stupid so it is another question to ask before buying.

I'm guessing you don't work in the car industry where fuel consumption figures are very important.
The car will already be much heavier than normal with all the EV equipment so the fuel consumption will be high. Charging the battery will add further load on the engine and reduce consumption further. So it's not quite as stupid as you might think.

FreeBear

subjecttocontract said:

ProDave said:

subjecttocontract said:

A PHEV would not be able to provide enough charge through e.g. regenerative braking to eliminate the need to plug in to the mains. It's called a plug in hybrid for a reason.....that's because you would need to plug it in.

A friend of mine had a Toyota Prius PHEV and that most definitely did charge from the engine while driving.  The point in his case was charging it from the mains at home meant it was able to do a lot of his local journeys as an EV and still have the benefits of a hybrid on longer journeys.

It seems madness to make a plug in hybrid that does not charge from the engine as well.  At least I now know some manufacturers are that stupid so it is another question to ask before buying.

I'm guessing you don't work in the car industry where fuel consumption figures are very important.
The car will already be much heavier than normal with all the EV equipment so the fuel consumption will be high. Charging the battery will add further load on the engine and reduce consumption further. So it's not quite as stupid as you might think.

But then if you use regenerative braking, the battery would be charged for free whilst slowing down.

Ryan_Holden

Thank you for all your input and help.

I'm grateful to all of your who have given me options to consider and things to look at, plus given me feedback on how I handled the situation.

I have just told him that this is not something I will be on board with and explained that I'm concerned about the risks with long term 3 pin charging in a house with old wiring and non-EV rated sockets and lots of high current regularly. 

I am already aware of lots of issues with sockets getting hot, and since I am away every other weekend for 3 days I would not be happy with the idea of him leaving it connected for days at a time and not checking it.

I have also told him that I'm very sorry about it and I do not feel happy with basically partially dictating what he can and cannot do with his money, but that the integrity and safety of my house, and my peace of mind, must come first.

Really, really appreciate the help today navigating this little dilemma. I feel much happier I've made a decision on it.

Thanks again folks.

RHemmings

What was his reaction? 

Grumpy_chap

Bigphil1474 said:

For 3 miles each way, I'd give them a lift and charge them £2.70 a day - they'll save a fortune compared to running a car and it would cover the costs. 

Round our way three miles, walk or cycle, will be quicker than driving, keeps you fitter, and saves a fortune