Home Insurance - single occupancy increases the renewal quote?

EnquiringMind33

user1977 said:

Auti said:

My house insurance increased because of now only one adult in the property (and child) instead of 2. Reason given was house empty more and less people to spot problems. Standard practice apparently. 

But had they asked you specifically how many adults/children lived there?

For me (the OP), that's a very interesting question. My expiring policy was set up with them in 2021 to run for 3 years, I've made no adjustments to it since and don't think I've contacted them about it until this year, to set up the next policy. Given the time since I took it out, I can't remember the questions asked nor the way I set it up, but likely found via an aggregator site, but from then on directly with the company; I would definitely have spoken to the insurance firm to ask them questions. Unsure if I set it up in one of those phone conversations, but probably by completing their online form, as I printed out the resulting policy. I didn't take screenshots of any form I filled - wish I had!

It's apparently impossible to see their exact questions now without destroying my existing by-phone quote. They may have changed the wording of this specific question since 2021, as the first year's policy (2021) has a different resultant wording for this point than it does now (I now see it changed in 2022 to the current format).

The original wording was "We assume that the insured property is not let to tenants and is lived in by yourself and your immediate family only"

Now it is "You have told us your property is a [lengthy spec of house type, construction materials, build date etc. is provided by them here and is correct], is your main home and is lived in by you and your family".

It's actually much harder to find the above reference to the occupancy in the current format!

A couple of days ago the 3 words "and your family" were edited out by the insurance company, resulting in a surprisingly large rise in the premium. Ironically, it was done because I raised it, having just noticed it myself, but I still thought it was just standard wording for the "no tenants" situation, and so did the rep I was speaking to. He discovered it was editable, so said let's try it, I doubt it'll make a difference anyway. Wrong!

I've asked what the wording of the relevant question is these days (or in the past). I've been told they don't specifically ask for numbers of people, but WHAT they ask is a bit different between their phone and online route, and that's all I was told. They have a recording of my first conversation with them back in 2021 (and maybe others if I've had any before this year, so they can check that/those if I insist).

I am 100% sure that I've always accurately answered any question they've asked about occupancy, however worded, as the situation hasn't changed and I have no reason to be confused about it or to answer any other way. It's either a misunderstanding on their part (of my response), and/or mine (in not realising before that it was significant that it says "and your family" - in fact, I hadn't even noticed until now!). But whenever I've phoned them, including several times this month, before the edit was made, I've mentioned that I live alone, as it always comes up in the conversation. So I'm very surprised that it was me, and not them, who actually checked whether that wording on my policy was 100% appropriate. I guess the onus is normally on the customer to check the fine print, though.

Worryingly (but no harm done, given the timing), the person I spoke to about all this thought that the miswording may mean my policy would have been void if I'd ever needed to claim!

EnquiringMind33

Thanks, DullGreyGuy - that's all very interesting info too. Regarding the rooms count, I have to put 3 bedrooms, though one is a room so small a single bed just fits and getting out of it would involve a collision with the wall, so instead it's just used as a "box room". This reminds me (I've an unfortunate tendency to over-think things, which leads to uncertainty, plus the different definitions that different insurance companies apply to the same or similar questions) - regarding the "how many other rooms?" question after counting the usual ones and applying the largely-consistent "don't count this, that and the other type rooms" - does one count an under-stairs (but proper room-type) pantry in this "other" category or just ignore it? I can never decide...! Again, it often seems that some insurance firms don't even care - but my current "and your family" situation tells me that there can be wording pitfalls you never even notice (until it's too late, if you're really unlucky!).

DullGreyGuy

EnquiringMind33 said:

Thanks, DullGreyGuy - that's all very interesting info too. Regarding the rooms count, I have to put 3 bedrooms, though one is a room so small a single bed just fits and getting out of it would involve a collision with the wall, so instead it's just used as a "box room". This reminds me (I've an unfortunate tendency to over-think things, which leads to uncertainty, plus the different definitions that different insurance companies apply to the same or similar questions) - regarding the "how many other rooms?" question after counting the usual ones and applying the largely-consistent "don't count this, that and the other type rooms" - does one count an under-stairs (but proper room-type) pantry in this "other" category or just ignore it? I can never decide...! Again, it often seems that some insurance firms don't even care - but my current "and your family" situation tells me that there can be wording pitfalls you never even notice (until it's too late, if you're really unlucky!).

If you go directly to an insurers website, or telephone them, they ask the questions that are relevant with the appropriate options. The problem is that for people that switch the aggregators are king and there the questions have to cover all the things that all the people on their panel want asked (or at least the big boys that can call the shots) and hence it all gets a bit messy because you've bedroom and sum insured rating questions in there etc. 

The general rule of thumb is how an estate agent would market it but at the end of the day you just need to read the question along with any helper text and answer it honestly with that information in mind. The FOS will side with the customer if their interpretation was reasonable even if it didnt match what the insurer had intended. Not seen your understair pantry so cannot say for certain but most cases "storage cupboards" are cupboards not rooms 

EnquiringMind33

DullGreyGuy said:

EnquiringMind33 said:

Thanks, DullGreyGuy - that's all very interesting info too. Regarding the rooms count, I have to put 3 bedrooms, though one is a room so small a single bed just fits and getting out of it would involve a collision with the wall, so instead it's just used as a "box room". This reminds me (I've an unfortunate tendency to over-think things, which leads to uncertainty, plus the different definitions that different insurance companies apply to the same or similar questions) - regarding the "how many other rooms?" question after counting the usual ones and applying the largely-consistent "don't count this, that and the other type rooms" - does one count an under-stairs (but proper room-type) pantry in this "other" category or just ignore it? I can never decide...! Again, it often seems that some insurance firms don't even care - but my current "and your family" situation tells me that there can be wording pitfalls you never even notice (until it's too late, if you're really unlucky!).

If you go directly to an insurers website, or telephone them, they ask the questions that are relevant with the appropriate options. The problem is that for people that switch the aggregators are king and there the questions have to cover all the things that all the people on their panel want asked (or at least the big boys that can call the shots) and hence it all gets a bit messy because you've bedroom and sum insured rating questions in there etc. 

The general rule of thumb is how an estate agent would market it but at the end of the day you just need to read the question along with any helper text and answer it honestly with that information in mind. The FOS will side with the customer if their interpretation was reasonable even if it didnt match what the insurer had intended. Not seen your understair pantry so cannot say for certain but most cases "storage cupboards" are cupboards not rooms 

Thanks again! I am very sure that I did converse one way or another (verbally or via their own website forms) with the actual insurance firm I'm with when I took out the insurance that's about to expire, so I would have answered their own questions correctly and there was never any uncertainty from my side about how to interpret the number of occupants (1 in total) - they'd definitely know that from me, so the fact that their interpretation of my answer actually means they somehow managed to conclude I didn't live on my own suggests a mistake on their part. Of course, they may take the view that I should have spotted this for them earlier!

Regarding my pantry, it's a room in that you can open a door and step fully inside, though it's small enough that all you can then do is turn on the spot to reach the shelves, which are in front of, and to one side of you! It's basically just the wedge-shaped space beneath the top half of a single-storey (13 steps with a 90 degree turn towards the centre of the house for the last 2 steps only) staircase in a 1930s house.