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self assessment state pension statement
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mksysb said:sheramber said:mksysb said:mybestattempt said:mksysb said:sheramber said:mksysb said:Assuming you are paid monthly, just take one of the monthly payments during the year and multiply by 13.
Tax is charged on what you are due to receive, not what actually receive.
https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employment-income-manual/eim75700
https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employment-income-manual/eim75020
https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-pension/how-your-tax-is-paid
"After your first year of getting the State Pension, you’ll pay tax based on 52 weeks of payments each year."
This is exactly what is happening in my case.
e.g. My payment for April 24 was £36 less than the May payment as the pension increase only applied to two weeks of April.
13 x April payment would be wrong for my annual amount
13 X May would be wrong for my annual amount.Let me try and explain it again, as you clearly aren't getting it. The tax on state pensions is based on the accrual basis. This means it is based on what you are entitled to get in the tax year, not your actual payments. Obviously if your pension changes, the payments in April will be different. With the accrual basis you take what your weekly pension is, as advised by the DWP at the beginning of the new tax year and multiply it by 52. That is the amount you will be taxed on.I was just trying to put it in layman's terms for the OP when he asked how much pension he should put in his SA, when I suggested that if he was paid monthly as opposed to weekly he should multiply the sum he received by 13. I didn't realise that that would upset some people, as I should have said 28 day payment, but that was implied as I said to multiply by 13, and not 12. Obviously, you would not multiply the edge cases by 13, but just the normal amount received throughout the year. How you could misinterpret what the HMRC guide said I have no idea. They seemed to have explained it simply as possible.
Strangely though one of the HMRC documents says:-"Pensioners are often content to pay Income Tax on the amount received in a year, as in most years the amounts accruing and received are similar. However, it is possible in certain circumstances for the amounts to be different. If a taxpayer requests the statutory basis this should be accepted."
So it seems if you want to do it your way, just tell the HMRC people and they will accept it.
https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employment-income-manual/eim75020
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means - Inigo Montoya, The Princess Bride3 -
ajfhpuzzled9999 said:Can it really be true that the millions of pensioners who complete a yearly self assessment have no way to fill in the State Benefit Received box without calling a number and waiting up to 28 working days for a BR735? Adding up payments into the bank account gives the wrong number, and HMRC then write to tell you you messed up your return! This is madness!1
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Flugelhorn said:ajfhpuzzled9999 said:Can it really be true that the millions of pensioners who complete a yearly self assessment have no way to fill in the State Benefit Received box without calling a number and waiting up to 28 working days for a BR735? Adding up payments into the bank account gives the wrong number, and HMRC then write to tell you you messed up your return! This is madness!
That is a guess though.
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unholyangel said:Is this argument still going on?
The SA100 guidance notes for the 2023-2024 year, made available by HMRC to help you complete your tax return, give instructions of:Box 8 State Pension
Use the letter ‘About the general increase in benefits’ that the Pension Service sent you to find your weekly State Pension amount.
Add up the amount you were entitled to receive from 6 April 2023 to 5 April 2024 and put the total in box 8. For tax purposes, the correct amount is always the figure of weekly entitlement not the number of payments you received, so this will be the first week at the old weekly pension rate, plus 51 weeks at the new weekly pension rate.
’always the figure of weekly entitlement’
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mksysb said:sheramber said:mksysb said:mybestattempt said:mksysb said:sheramber said:mksysb said:Assuming you are paid monthly, just take one of the monthly payments during the year and multiply by 13.
Tax is charged on what you are due to receive, not what actually receive.
https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employment-income-manual/eim75700
https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employment-income-manual/eim75020
https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-pension/how-your-tax-is-paid
"After your first year of getting the State Pension, you’ll pay tax based on 52 weeks of payments each year."
This is exactly what is happening in my case.
e.g. My payment for April 24 was £36 less than the May payment as the pension increase only applied to two weeks of April.
13 x April payment would be wrong for my annual amount
13 X May would be wrong for my annual amount.Let me try and explain it again, as you clearly aren't getting it. The tax on state pensions is based on the accrual basis. This means it is based on what you are entitled to get in the tax year, not your actual payments. Obviously if your pension changes, the payments in April will be different. With the accrual basis you take what your weekly pension is, as advised by the DWP at the beginning of the new tax year and multiply it by 52. That is the amount you will be taxed on.I was just trying to put it in layman's terms for the OP when he asked how much pension he should put in his SA, when I suggested that if he was paid monthly as opposed to weekly he should multiply the sum he received by 13. I didn't realise that that would upset some people, as I should have said 28 day payment, but that was implied as I said to multiply by 13, and not 12. Obviously, you would not multiply the edge cases by 13, but just the normal amount received throughout the year. How you could misinterpret what the HMRC guide said I have no idea. They seemed to have explained it simply as possible.
Strangely though one of the HMRC documents says:-"Pensioners are often content to pay Income Tax on the amount received in a year, as in most years the amounts accruing and received are similar. However, it is possible in certain circumstances for the amounts to be different. If a taxpayer requests the statutory basis this should be accepted."
So it seems if you want to do it your way, just tell the HMRC people and they will accept it.
It that is not what my accrual amount is.My accrual amount is 1 week at old rate and 51 at new rate.
Why would it be correct to enter 13 X my ‘ normal amount received’?
You are the only one who is not getting it.2 -
I'd imagine a lot of state pensioners would fill out a tax return??? When I get there, god/providence willing, in ten years my income will consist of FIVE revenue streams:
1. State pension
2. UFPLS payments from my main DC pension
3 Teachers Pension DB
4. Employer DB pension
5. Small DC pension UFPLS
I imagine some people have even more than that.
I have no wish to consolidate these pensions together for a multitude of reasons.
What HMRC "object" ties all this lot together other than the SA ??0 -
MetaPhysical said:I'd imagine a lot of state pensioners would fill out a tax return??? When I get there, god/providence willing, in ten years my income will consist of FIVE revenue streams:
1. State pension
2. UFPLS payments from my main DC pension
3 Teachers Pension DB
4. Employer DB pension
5. Small DC pension UFPLS
I imagine some people have even more than that.
I have no wish to consolidate these pensions together for a multitude of reasons.
What HMRC "object" ties all this lot together other than the SA ??1 -
OK, thanks. Can you "select" which of the streams gets the PA set against it?
How would they then know about taxed interest if you go over the threshold?0 -
MetaPhysical said:OK, thanks. Can you "select" which of the streams gets the PA set against it?
How would they then know about taxed interest if you go over the threshold?
re interest they get told by the banks / building soc etc and either send you a bill or amend the code.
I am a pensioner doing SA, not sure why any longer and I thought they had stopped it but I still get told to do it and pay them ££££ after sending the form in0 -
Flugelhorn said:ajfhpuzzled9999 said:Can it really be true that the millions of pensioners who complete a yearly self assessment have no way to fill in the State Benefit Received box without calling a number and waiting up to 28 working days for a BR735? Adding up payments into the bank account gives the wrong number, and HMRC then write to tell you you messed up your return! This is madness!
The good news is that if they complete a digital return, the state pension figure is pre-filled for them.Fashion on the Ration
2024 - 43/66 coupons used, carry forward 23
2025 - 62/892
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