What percentage of a washing machine's energy is used purely to heat hot water?

1356789

Comments

  • JSHarris said:
    If regulations are written in blood then how come so many have zero basis in real risk and are so blown out of proportion?
    Because either things have progressed and the regulations refer to an older way of doing things, or the regulations have worked so the problem before no longer exists.  Sometimes a mix of both.

    Saying the regulations we already have are written in blood does not at all imply the existing regulations cover everything that's dangerous.  That's an entirely different matter that you added in yourself.

    My overall point was, there's often a very good reason for why practices and regulations that are maybe now outdated were introduced in the first place.  A lot of them were part of progress, and to view them as useless is to ignore parts of our history.

    (Not all, of course, sometimes things have been an overzealous reaction to an extremely rare event, and some modern practices and beliefs are the result of very effective, misleading campaigns to get people to spend more money - but we can't tar everything with that brush.)
  • JSHarris
    JSHarris Posts: 374 Forumite
    First Post Name Dropper
    Still puzzles me why we're losing all sense of proportion when it comes to real risk assessment.  If I were, for example, immunologically compromised for some reason, then I would be far more focussed on infection risks within my environment and immediate surroundings, as well as in what I ate and drank.  Thankfully I'm not, so I can leave 99.999% of my worries to be handled by the rather wonderful protective systems my body has developed, protective systems that exist in large part because they've been trained by exposure to a multitude of pathogens over the years I've been alive.
    Apart from the obvious distraction away from really significant risks all this worry about vanishingly small risks creates, there's also the problem of risk compensation, that may itself pose additional risks that may not have been considered.  I'll qualify the next bit by making it 100% clear that I'm not being in any way critical of any regulations or laws.  This is purely a good example of the principle of unintended consequences as applied to risk mitigation.
    When we introduced seat belt legislation in vehicles there was a massive reduction in car driver and passenger deaths and serious injuries.  This was expected; it's why the law was enacted, and was an enormous benefit to society in so many ways.  What wasn't expected was that in the years following the seat belt legislation many more pedestrians and other road users were killed and injured than had been before.  At first glance the two might seem unconnected, but it was soon discovered that drivers wearing seat belts felt safer and more secure, so tended to take greater risks  After all, their seat belt was there to protect them from harm.
    They might drive a little faster, pay less attention to other road users, not be as aware of other risks around them, feel falsely confident in their ability to not come to any harm.  This was risk compensation in action.  Reducing a major risk created other major risks, and they have been far harder to mitigate.  We're still working on how best to mitigate them, even now, 40 years later.  Our village introduced a 20mph limit a couple of years ago, as yet another attempt to try and reduce the risks to others caused by safe and secure feeling drivers.  Every improvement in driver and passenger safety tends to have an adverse impact on the safety of other road users (as any regular cyclist or motorcyclist may confirm).
    The same applies to discussions like this about the risk from washing clothes and bedding at low temperatures, with the intention of saving energy and money and then facing criticism on the basis that there is a credible risk associated with doing this.  Sure there is a very, very tiny risk that a pathogen may survive, and then somehow cause infection, and that infection might get past our rather wonderful immune system, and having done that it might then develop into something that may make us unwell, and from there may cause a secondary infection that poses a risk to life.  Focussing on this improbable chain of events, perhaps to the detriment of other, far greater risks (like washing hands after plastering them with many millions of potentially lethal pathogens when doing the gardening) is the risk management equivalent of taking our eye off the ball.  Better we pay more attention to the significant and more probable risks than waste our lives worrying about things that are very unlikely to ever happen.
    Each of us needs to consider risk in the context of our own risk appetite, taking a carefully balanced view of how significant any risk may really be.  We can't wrap ourselves in a sterile, cushioned cocoon and still enjoy life.  We need some risk in our lives to add to the pleasure of life itself.  It's why so many people are attracted to potentially dangerous adventure sports.  I've lived most of my life already, but I'm damned if I'm going to live out my remaining years paying more attention to the risks of dying than the enjoyment of living.
  • Bendo
    Bendo Posts: 291 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    Modern washing machines use so little water these days, unless you are on stored water and it's near the machine,  it's unlikely to get much of a hot fill. A combi is unlikely to heat water by the time the machine is full so probably just waste gas.
  • QrizB
    QrizB Posts: 13,822 Forumite
    First Anniversary First Post Photogenic Name Dropper
    Bendo said:
    Modern washing machines use so little water these days, unless you are on stored water and it's near the machine,  it's unlikely to get much of a hot fill. A combi is unlikely to heat water by the time the machine is full so probably just waste gas.
    My thoughts are similar.
    The digression into risk management seems largely unhelpful.in the context of this thread.

    N. Hampshire, he/him. Octopus Go elec & Tracker gas / Shell BB / Lyca mobi. Ripple Kirk Hill member.
    2.72kWp PV facing SSW installed Jan 2012. 11 x 247w panels, 3.6kw inverter. 30MWh generated, long-term average 2.6 Os.
    Taking a break, hope to be back eventually.
    Ofgem cap table, Ofgem cap explainer. Economy 7 cap explainer. Gas vs E7 vs peak elec heating costs.
  • I'm not sure about this historical (it was ok for my parents and grandparents thing) but I have noticed a lot more people reducing temperatures for washing etc and that's good for the pocket but not great for the bacteria.

    I put the washing machine on a 90oC clean the washing machine cycle once every week and with two teenagers I put their bed clothes on a 60oC wash as who knows what's going on there(we do know but we like to think we don't lol)

    I think all these save as much as possible ideas like low water temps for your showers and baths and low temps for washing is great for the fit and healthy stages of life where you can fend off bacteria and bugs. However if you are entering the twilight or feeling the strain on health then make sure you attend to the risks of getting rid of nasty things from your life that you can control at home.

    The debate could go on and on but just thought I would put my thoughts in and remember no one is right or wrong here we just can't pass on what we do as "hard fact" ignoring any risks as that could affect someone's life.


  • Petriix
    Petriix Posts: 2,040 Forumite
    First Anniversary First Post Name Dropper
    No bacteria can survive the 60 degree wash so a weekly 90 degree cleaning cycle seems excessive; it's a once a year type of thing (if at all). I don't think there's particularly a correlation between what goes on in someone's bed and the temperature you wash the sheets at. It's unlikely that anyone would get ill from washing sheets at 40 degrees. Ultimately that all sounds like a massive waste of energy and money. 
  • Petriix said:
    No bacteria can survive the 60 degree wash so a weekly 90 degree cleaning cycle seems excessive; it's a once a year type of thing (if at all). I don't think there's particularly a correlation between what goes on in someone's bed and the temperature you wash the sheets at. It's unlikely that anyone would get ill from washing sheets at 40 degrees. Ultimately that all sounds like a massive waste of energy and money. 
    I just do it to clean the washing machine it's a set cycle on our Bosch. The dishwasher also has the same thing.

    Probably started this during COVID and haven't stopped.

    I have the same discussions with my sister. I am happy for others to do as they please so in no way forcing this down anyone's throat. We are on Octopus tracker with Solar and batteries so realistically it's not a waste of a lot of money and everything is bacteria free. Not a germafobe in any way but when energy costs so little why not. Our total bill for the year after everything is £600. Ridiculous really.
  • Grizzlebeard
    Grizzlebeard Posts: 283 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    JSHarris said:
    ........ distraction claiming otherwise (FWIW all recorded cases come from badly designed or maintained commercial systems or those warm cesspits some call hot tubs).

    Add digging garden compost heaps to this very short list.
                - And even then I've only ever read 2 news reports on this.
    Shock horror!!!

  • Sterlingtimes
    Sterlingtimes Posts: 2,392 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary
    It is the Ebac machine, as advertised on GB News,  that I ordered.

    The headline claims by Ebac are:
    save up to 27% a year in running costs; 
    up to 64% less energy used a wash;
    up to 21minutes quicker wash;
    element lasts 43% longer

    What is Hot Fill? - Ebac

    The figures may be over-egged, but I think that for £30 extra for the hot fill, it is worth a try as a 531 kWh/year user. I will have my power meter at the ready.
    I have osteoarthritis in my hands so I speak my messages into a microphone using Dragon. Some people make "typos" but I often make "speakos".
  • Alnat1
    Alnat1 Posts: 3,278 Forumite
    First Anniversary First Post Name Dropper
    Only time I do a 90C wash is when Agile pays me to do it, couple of times a year is enough for me. I wipe inside the seal regularly, this is where any smelly gunk seems to lurk. Most of my washes now are 30C, machine is 10+ years old and hasn't a 20C option or I'd give that a go.

    I don't understand the need to boil up bedding and towels to any higher temperatures than other laundry. Towels especially are only used for a minute or two when you're really clean and probably have less bacteria than an item you wear all day. It's your own bacteria too, not anything "nasty" from outdoors, so your immune system is already used to handling it.
    Barnsley, South Yorkshire
    Solar PV 5.25kWp SW facing (14 x 375 Longi) Lux 3.6kw hybrid inverter and 4.8kw Pylontech battery storage installed March 22
    Octopus Agile/Fixed Outgoing and Tracker gas
Meet your Ambassadors

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 343.1K Banking & Borrowing
  • 250.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 449.7K Spending & Discounts
  • 235.2K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 607.9K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 173K Life & Family
  • 247.8K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 15.9K Discuss & Feedback
  • 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards