Changing executor on a Will - implications

Spivved1987

For various reasons - not least the person's age - I wish to change one of the Executors on my Will and also my wife's. We do not have Mirror Wills, just to get that one out of the way.

We made our Wills nearly 10 years ago, and there is no change to any of the Wills' provisions in terms of beneficiaries etc. However when I contacted my solicitor I was advised that even a change to an Executor entails drawing up a new Will which means, in addition to charging us a few hundred quid for having a typist change one name, it would also be registered as a new Will dated (say) January 2024, rather than February 2015 as is the current Wills' dates.

I believe (but would be happy to be proven wrong) that this has no IHT implications, because gifting etc dates backwards from the date of death, and the Will date is not relevant. I am however concerned that the DDoA police will look at the new date to calculate whether things 'could have been foreseeable' in 2024 whereas they would not be able to make the same inferences about a Will made nearly 10 years ago.  Not that there is any change in our health, I hasten to add, but obviously 2024 is a lot nearer than 2015 to the time when such things could happen.

Any thoughts?

WillowCat

An executor change is a very small and simple change and would normally be done by adding a codicil to the will (which must also be witnessed).

It sounds like your solicitor is simply trying to extract more cash from you.

doodling

Hi,

Wills cannot have any impact on deprivation of assets.  A dead person cannot deprive themselves of anything.

If for some reason you left a dependant destitute by giving all your money to a local dogs home then it is possible that in certain circumstances someone could act on behalf of that dependant to make an inheritance act claim but my understanding is that there is quite a short time limit on that (6 months from grant of probate).

Don't worry about the date of the will.  The only thing you need to worry about is whether the solicitor is offering value for money, which is debatable.

If you are really confident that the will still meets you needs then there is nothing stopping you retyping it yourself.  It is an important document so you need to make sure you copy it exactly (apart from the name and date changes!), bind it appropriately and that it is properly witnessed.  If you are uncertain about what is right in any of those areas then a solicitor may be worthwhile, even if the cost annoys.

Keep_pedalling

Spivved1987 said:

I believe (but would be happy to be proven wrong) that this has no IHT implications, because gifting etc dates backwards from the date of death, and the Will date is not relevant. I am however concerned that the DDoA police will look at the new date to calculate whether things 'could have been foreseeable' in 2024 whereas they would not be able to make the same inferences about a Will made nearly 10 years ago.  Not that there is any change in our health, I hasten to add, but obviously 2024 is a lot nearer than 2015 to the time when such things could happen.

Any thoughts?

My thoughts are that this makes no sense, gifting is something you do when you are alive, your will deals with your estate on the day of your death. Your will deals with your inheritable estate only, IHT covers both your inheritable estate and non exempt gifts from the previous 7 years.

If you are sure there is nothing in you will that needs changing other than the executors then you just need a codicil, however it is worth reviewing the whole will after ten years to make sure it still makes best use of any changes in the tax rules since the original was drafted, e.g. the introduction of the RNRB.

Roger175

This is just the way with many solicitors I'm afraid. I don't like to tar them all with the same brush as I'm sure there are some reasonable ones around. 
We had a horrible experience about 6 years ago, when we bought a building plot. The access was via a track which seemingly had no owner, so we needed a Statutory Declaration from the vendor. This was drawn up by her solicitor at her expense and all we needed to do was arrange to get her signature witnessed in the presence of an independent solicitor - the lady was elderly and housebound, so we needed to get a solicitor to come out to her - the cheapest quote we could get was £350 plus VAT. This was from a solicitor who practiced in the same town (less than 2 miles away) and it involved witnessing a signature which took less than 5 minutes.  You couldn't make it up! In the end, an old school friend solicitor drove over on a Sunday morning (a 2 hour round trip) and did it for us as a favour.

Brie

Or wait til there's a free will month happening and do the changes for the price of a small donation to charity??

Marcon

Spivved1987 said:

For various reasons - not least the person's age - I wish to change one of the Executors on my Will and also my wife's. We do not have Mirror Wills, just to get that one out of the way.

We made our Wills nearly 10 years ago, and there is no change to any of the Wills' provisions in terms of beneficiaries etc. However when I contacted my solicitor I was advised that even a change to an Executor entails drawing up a new Will which means, in addition to charging us a few hundred quid for having a typist change one name, it would also be registered as a new Will dated (say) January 2024, rather than February 2015 as is the current Wills' dates.

I believe (but would be happy to be proven wrong) that this has no IHT implications, because gifting etc dates backwards from the date of death, and the Will date is not relevant. I am however concerned that the DDoA police will look at the new date to calculate whether things 'could have been foreseeable' in 2024 whereas they would not be able to make the same inferences about a Will made nearly 10 years ago.  Not that there is any change in our health, I hasten to add, but obviously 2024 is a lot nearer than 2015 to the time when such things could happen.

Any thoughts?

Are you sure the solicitor is simply going to (effectively) retype the will with the name of one executor changed? Things have changed since 2015, not least the introduction of the Residence Nil Rate Band, which could have an impact on you/your wife, depending on how you have phrased your bequests.

You could simply add a codicil if you are certain nothing else is changing - but make sure it is correctly signed/witnessed/dated with the actual date (which has no impact on IHT or DOA).

km1500

the only other thing perhaps is to consider whether he really do need to change executors it seems that you have more than one so unless there is some other reason I expect only one of them will act anyway

user1977

Roger175 said:

we needed a Statutory Declaration from the vendor. This was drawn up by her solicitor at her expense and all we needed to do was arrange to get her signature witnessed in the presence of an independent solicitor - the lady was elderly and housebound, so we needed to get a solicitor to come out to her - the cheapest quote we could get was £350 plus VAT. This was from a solicitor who practiced in the same town (less than 2 miles away) and it involved witnessing a signature which took less than 5 minutes.  You couldn't make it up!

We're off on a tangent from the OP, but that doesn't sound all that unreasonable to me. It isn't a 5 minute piece of work once you include the correspondence at either end, the travel time, and being force fed cups of tea... And frankly the bureaucracy involved in taking on a new client, opening a file and dealing with the billing can alone take an hour before you actually spend any time on the job itself.

Plus there's the responsibility element - who do you think would have to answer questions if there is a later claim that she didn't understand what she was signing?

Savvy_Sue

km1500 said:

the only other thing perhaps is to consider whether he really do need to change executors it seems that you have more than one so unless there is some other reason I expect only one of them will act anyway

I wondered that too. Even if there's no provision within the will for one executor to stand down, it can be done. And a chat with the elderly one along the lines of "you know you can stand down and leave it all for Fred and Ginger?" may be all thats needed.

However, if there were only 2 executors to begin with, that does leave the remaining sole executor under more pressure,  plus all the "what ifs" - predeceased, incapacitated etc. So in that situation I would want to make the change. 

Spivved1987

km1500 said:

the only other thing perhaps is to consider whether he really do need to change executors it seems that you have more than one so unless there is some other reason I expect only one of them will act anyway

To be honest my mistake was assuming (incorrectly) back in 2015 that Executors could not be Beneficiaries, so the two Executors (same people for both Wills) are not spouse or offspring. In retrospect I should have made my wife one of my Executors, and myself one of hers.