Smart parking

user200152

Sorry for the long post.
As per previous posts I should have come to this forum earlier. Read your newbies guide but wanted some advice. I have already unfortunately appealed my smart parking penalty and have likely divulged i’m the driver as I thought this was a simple win as I had paid for a parking ticket but didn’t realise I was part of a bigger scam. I have already complained to the landowner dreamland car park in Margate but I’m not optimistic as there are some news articles about people doing this and nothing happening. I live no way near Margate so can’t really go back and take pictures of their sign boards 

Details about the incident: 
Parking in Arlington car park Margate. Arrival time was 11.43 and exit time 15.56 on 09/08/23 according to the ANPR system. Parked the car and got a baby out so this process obviously took time. Paid via ringo as there were no machines there that I could see and have the receipt. Ringo states session duration on 09/08/23 was from 11.55am to 3.55pm. Got a letter for the pcn, the date issued was 4/9/23 but letter actually arrived 13/9/23. I appealed as thought it was pretty straightforward process (how stupid of me in hindsight). Appeal confirmed by them on 15/9/23 via email. 1st debt recovery letter sent on 10/11/23. Appealed again on that date. 2nd debt recovery letter received 7/12/23 and finally a response from them rejecting my appeal on 7/12/23. Also they didn’t respond to my appeal in October as they have stated below. Checked junk mail and everything. Response as follows:  

Dear XXX
POPLA Verification Code: XXX

Parking Charge Notice: XXX
Thank you for your recent communication. 
Having considered your appeal in detail we have decided to uphold the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) as we believe that it was correctly issued in accordance with the terms and conditions advertised within the area concerned. As your appeal was received within the initial discount period we have extended the discount period until 22/12/2023.
Please be advised we did respond to your original appeal via email on 04/10/2023, please find a copy attached below, as a gesture of goodwill we have reinstated the discount period of the PCN which is valid until the above aforementioned date.
We note the comments made in your appeal, however we can not rescind the PCN on this basis. As tickets can be purchased at any point during your stay before exiting the car park, our payment system is unaware of what time a ticket is being purchased, whether purchased by ticket machines/payment methods such as RingGo. Therefore it is the motorist's responsibility to ensure they cover the full duration of their stay, calculated from entrance to exit. Subsequently, if a ticket is purchased upon exiting the car park, the expiry time shown will not be applicable and only the amount of time purchased is relevant.
We can confirm that the contravention is in relation to insufficient paid time. This is due to the fact that our payment system confirms that 240 minutes were purchased against Vehicle Registration Mark (VRM) XXX however the vehicle was on site for 251 minutes. The signage clearly informs drivers to purchase a valid ticket for the duration of their stay. Please also be advised that additional time can be purchased at any point during your vehicles stay, before exiting the car park, in order to cover any unexpected overstays due to circumstances such as those outlined in your appeal.              
We wish to inform that the car park in question is operated by ANPR cameras which capture images of your vehicle entering and exiting the site, which subsequently calculates your total stay duration. This information is then paired with the information entered into the payment machine to ensure the correct payment has been made against the full and correct vehicle registration for the total duration the vehicle is on site, which is calculated from entrance to exit.
As the vehicle was on site in excess of the time purchased and no additional payments were made to cover the entire duration of the stay, we can confirm that the advertised Terms and Conditions were breached and subsequently the PCN has been issued correctly. The Terms and Conditions of the car park are clearly advertised around the site and must be adhered to by all drivers.
You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure and therefore you now have two options, you can pay or appeal - you cannot do both. 
If the PCN was issued in England and Wales you also have the right of appeal to an independent appeals service (POPLA). If you wish to make an appeal to POPLA the forms are available on their website at xxx
The verification code you will need in order to appeal to the Independent Appeals Service is XXX. It is important that you reference this on the appeals form as appeals submitted without this code will not be assessed. You have 28 days from the date of this letter to lodge your appeal with POPLA. Please note, should you decide to appeal to POPLA and your appeal is subsequently rejected, the option to pay a discounted amount will no longer be available and the full amount of the PCN will become due.

As the driver was mentioned in the appeals to smart parking is it still worth doing a POPLA appeal without mentioning the driver and using your previous POPLA templates (I understand the longer the better). Or shall I just ignore and see where they take this ridiculous fine. 

Coupon-mad

Yes give POPLA a go. Worth the laugh.

You won't be paying Smart Parking.

Do you think there was a VRM digit typo or the wrong vehicle was paid for on the app? Check.

user200152

Coupon-mad said:

Yes give POPLA a go. Worth the laugh.

You won't be paying Smart Parking.

Do you think there was a VRM digit typo or the wrong vehicle was paid for on the app? Check.

Thank you for your response. So the correct vehicle was paid for on the app and they know it. They claim I paid for 240 minutes on the app but was in the car park for a total of 251 minutes as picked on their ANPR system, There were no machines I could pay on from what I remember so used the app Obviously getting out of the car with a baby in tow and then filling out the details on the app to pay takes time.

Coupon-mad

OK.  Use your phone to film a friend or relative filling out the app from scratch on their phone, like you did.  Include that video in evidence.

And do mention the baby.  POPLA need this level of detail:

Obviously getting out of the car with a baby in tow and then filling out the details on the app to pay takes time. 

Coupon-mad

user200152 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Yes give POPLA a go. Worth the laugh.

You won't be paying Smart Parking.

Do you think there was a VRM digit typo or the wrong vehicle was paid for on the app? Check.

Thank you for your response. So the correct vehicle was paid for on the app and they know it. They claim I paid for 240 minutes on the app but was in the car park for a total of 251 minutes as picked on their ANPR system, There were no machines I could pay on from what I remember so used the app Obviously getting out of the car with a baby in tow and then filling out the details on the app to pay takes time.

What happened with your POPLA appeal?

Chieflasagnaeater

Hi, did you appeal, what was the outcome?