IMPORTANT: Please make sure your posts do not contain any personally identifiable information (both your own and that of others). When uploading images, please take care that you have redacted all personal information including QR codes, number plates and reference numbers.

CCJ Set Aside Following Parking Fine

Firstly thanks to anyone who gives up their time to look at this.

As a back story, I re-joined a leisure centre in November 2022. When I was a previous member the rules of parking were 3 hours free and then times beyond that required the car park ticket being validated by a member of staff, signage explaining this procedure is also still used within the car park to this day.

On re-joining I was not made aware of new parking procedures which involved registering your vehicle on a tablet device, a couple of weeks post joining a number of posters and initiatives were set up by the leisure centre informing people of the parking procedures. Some time after joining I received letters from Smart Parking Ltd making me aware of three fines that had over-run their initial payment periods all occurring in my first week of joining the leisure centre. I should point out that I suspect I did not receive my initial fine payment letters as my V5C was not registered at my current address (something which I had completely forgot about when moving to my current property in 2017). 

I spoke to the leisure centre about my fines, informing them at the same time of not being made aware of the correct parking procedures and they suggested I initially write to Smart Parking Ltd asking for when the fines were received, which I did with a subject to access email in March 2023. Following dialogue with the leisure centre over a number of months and some severe procrastination (yes I'm a k**b) on my behalf they agreed to cancel my fines, and this was finally done in October 2023. In the time between my initial dialogue and the cancelling of my parking charges I received a Claim Form (15th September 2023) which I did not act upon and have subsequently found out that I now have a CCJ.

I have started putting together an N244 application using the very helpful information on this website but have yet to come across a scenario similar to my own whereby the land owner has agreed to cancel the fines yet I have still received a CCJ (as a result of my own procrastination). My question is are there any additional benefits to this situation that I could add to my case? 

Happy to put the content of my N244 app if anyone thinks it would be of use.
«134

Comments

  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 129,195
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    Forumite
    edited 4 December 2023 at 10:20PM
    Please show the Claim form. Haven't seen many Smart Parking claims this year!  Redact your VRM and MCOL password & claim number and your name/address.

    Did you receive the claim at the right address?

    Your chances of set aside are shaky but you have no choice but to try, because you already have a CCJ and paying it (shudder...) won't wipe it if the judgment in default was over 30 days ago...was it?

    Finally and this is just as important and won't take long:

    Are you aware of this Inquiry that I think will interest anyone who has had to face the hurdles involved in a CCJ set aside case from a rogue parking firm:

    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80417494/#Comment_80417494

    Closes in just over a week.

    Those with CCJ evidence are encouraged to show your paperwork and tell the Committee that parking 'charges' should never cause this level of consumer harm.

    Change is happening. Help steer it!

    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Thanks for the response - I have uploaded my claim form with the redacted information as requested.

    To answer your questions, the claim form was sent to my correct address and  having looked at my credit report the CCJ date appears as 9th October 2023.

    For my information, does the fact that the council agreed to remove my fines through correspondence with smart parking ltd have no bearing on my CCJ?

    Thanks for the link I will definitely take a look.


  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 129,195
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    Forumite
    edited 4 December 2023 at 11:37PM
    I think the arguments you have to support your N244, to include as exhibits with your WS, are:

    The CCJ should be set aside under CPR 13.3, there being several good reasons to support the fact that the CCJ should not stand under the circumstances and I should be afforded the opportunity to defend it, or in the alternative, a chance for the parking operator Claimant to discontinue the Claim (as per the instructions of their principal) once this CCJ is set aside:

    - the Claim was defective. It does not even explain how many parking charges are being sought, the dates of them (assuming more than two) or what the terms were, or what the various alleged breaches were, why the sum is so extortionately high and why interest appears to have been applied on the whole quantum from an unknown single date when it would be impossible for £510 to have been due.  The POC appear to be in breach of CPR 16.4, 16PD3 and 16PD7, and fail to "state all facts necessary for the purpose of formulating a complete cause of action". The Defendant was unable, on the basis of the POC, to understand with certainty what case, allegation(s) and what heads of cost were being pursued, and believed that the charges were being cancelled.  This all made it particularly difficult to respond with a 'defence' at the time.  Compliance with the CPRs is not optional for a Claimant - and their breach came first, and their breach caused my difficulty in knowing how to defend. If the parking operator believed that there was an adequate case it needs to be properly pleaded, with supplementary Particulars in multi-PCN cases.

    - copy the two paragraphs immediately under 'Preliminary matter: The claim should be struck out' here, including adding the full transcript as an exhibit:
    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80343627/#Comment_80343627


    - This extremely poor pleading means the case only became apparent to me late in the process.  I did not know how to defend an unquantified sum of £510 which bore no relation to any signs, and where there was no allegation set out that I could have reasonably been expected to respond to at the time of the Claim.

    - I did not ignore it; the landowner wanted the charges cancelled and the Claimant knows this yet still pressed ahead with a default CCJ.  Rightly or wrongly, I continued to complain to the parking operator's principal (landowner - the leisure centre) and following dialogue with the leisure centre that had commenced before the date of the Claim, they agreed to cancel these parking charges and this was finally confirmed in October 2023. See Exhibit x.

    - In the time - between my initial dialogue and the confirmation of the cancelling of all parking charges - this Claimant had not only filed a claim but sought default judgment, despite knowing that the landowner had contacted them to require cancellation.


    P.S.
    I suggest you urgently contact CST Law THIS WEEK (and not by phone, obvs!) and request that their Clients are shown the above rationale which you will be arguing in your N244 and respond within seven days whether or not they will consent to the application and if so, provide you with their standard Consent Order.

    ONLY GIVE THEM 7 DAYS. DO NOT DELAY LONGER.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • raburgess1
    raburgess1 Posts: 27
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite
    edited 21 December 2023 at 1:32PM
    Thanks again for the response and I really do appreciate the time taken to respond. Unfortunately personal circumstances have got in the way of me preparing this email but I have drafted the below to CST Law ready to send on as soon as possible. Having read through the arguments I have two queries in relation to the last two arguments (in bold below) which I would just like confirming prior to sending this email. 

    Firstly, my parking charges were cancelled on the 18th October 2023, this was via a transaction of £60 (£20 per parking charge) made to the Leisure Centre to cover fees associated with getting the parking charges cancelled. I was told that the fees were as a result of how far along the parking charges were in the process. I had chased up the Leisure Centre whilst consulting this forum and they confirmed the following via email:

    "I am just emailing you to confirm that your parking fines TC2588883, TC72567012 and TC72588883 have been paid to smart parking on 09/11/23. And we are currently in the process of being chased up, so please leave this with us."

    Secondly I have no idea whether the Leisure Centre had dialogue with smart parking during the process of me trying to get the charges removed.

    Does this have any affect on the final two arguments that I have written within my email below? And should I use the transaction or the email above as the exhibit?

    Dear Sir/Madam,

    I am writing in response to parking charges I received whilst using the car parking at Hengrove Leisure Centre and as a result of which I now have a CCJ against my name. I would request that your Clients are shown the below rational which I will be arguing within my N244 application.

    The CCJ should be set aside under CPR 13.3, there being several good reasons to support the fact that the CCJ should not stand under the circumstances and I should be afforded the opportunity to defend it, or in the alternative, a chance for the parking operator Claimant to discontinue the Claim (as per the instructions of their principal) once this CCJ is set aside:
    • The Claim was defective. It does not even explain how many parking charges are being sought, the dates of them (assuming more than two) or what the terms were, or what the various alleged breaches were, why the sum is so extortionately high and why interest appears to have been applied on the whole quantum from an unknown single date when it would be impossible for £510 to have been due.  The POC appear to be in breach of CPR 16.4, 16PD3 and 16PD7, and fail to "state all facts necessary for the purpose of formulating a complete cause of action". The Defendant was unable, on the basis of the POC, to understand with certainty what case, allegation(s) and what heads of cost were being pursued, and believed that the charges were being cancelled.  This all made it particularly difficult to respond with a 'defence' at the time.  Compliance with the CPRs is not optional for a Claimant - and their breach came first, and their breach caused my difficulty in knowing how to defend. If the parking operator believed that there was an adequate case it needs to be properly pleaded, with supplementary Particulars in multi-PCN cases.
    • The Defendant draws to the attention of the allocating Judge that there is now a persuasive Appeal judgment to support striking out the claim (in these exact circumstances of typically poorly pleaded private parking claims, and the extant PoC seen here are far worse than the one seen on Appeal).  The Defendant believes that dismissing this meritless claim is the correct course, with the Overriding Objective in mind.  Bulk litigators (legal firms) should know better than to make little or no attempt to comply with the Practice Direction.  By continuing to plead cases with generic auto-fill unspecific wording, private parking firms should not be surprised when courts strike out their claims based in the following persuasive authority.
    • A recent persuasive appeal judgment in Civil Enforcement Limited v Chan (Ref. E7GM9W44) would indicate the POC fails to comply with Civil Procedure Rule 16.4(1)(e) and Practice Direction Part 16.7.5. On the 15th August 2023, in the cited case, HHJ Murch held that 'the particulars of the claim as filed and served did not set out the conduct which amounted to the breach in reliance upon which the claimant would be able to bring a claim for breach of contract'. The same is true in this case and in view of the Chan judgment (transcript attached) the Court should strike out the claim, using its powers pursuant to CPR 3.4. 
    • This extremely poor pleading means the case only became apparent to me late in the process.  I did not know how to defend an unquantified sum of £510 which bore no relation to any signs, and where there was no allegation set out that I could have reasonably been expected to respond to at the time of the Claim.
    • I did not ignore it; the landowner wanted the charges cancelled and the Claimant knows this yet still pressed ahead with a default CCJ.  Rightly or wrongly, I continued to complain to the parking operator's principal (landowner - the leisure centre) and following dialogue with the leisure centre that had commenced before the date of the Claim, they agreed to cancel these parking charges and this was finally confirmed in October 2023. See Exhibit x.
    • In the time between my initial dialogue and the confirmation of the cancelling of all parking charges this Claimant had not only filed a claim but sought default judgment, despite knowing that the landowner had contacted them to require cancellation.
    Could you please respond within seven days as to whether or not you will consent to the application and if so, provide me with your standard consent form.

    Yours Faithfully,

    Thanks again for the time taken to answer this post it is appreciated.

  • Firstly, my parking charges were cancelled on the 18th October 2023, this was via a transaction of £60 (£20 per parking fine) made to the Leisure Centre to cover fees associated with getting the parking fines cancelled. I was told that the fees were as a result of how far along the parking fines were in the process. I had chased up the Leisure Centre whilst consulting this forum and they confirmed the following via email:

    "I am just emailing you to confirm that your parking fines TC2588883, TC72567012 and TC72588883 have been paid to smart parking on 09/11/23. And we are currently in the process of being chased up, so please leave this with us."

    Secondly I have no idea whether the Leisure Centre had dialogue with smart parking during the process of me trying to get the fines removed.

    Does this have any affect on the final two arguments that I have written within my email below? And should I use the transaction as an exhibit or the email??

    To Whom It May Concern,
    ...

    Regards
    Why do you still insist on calling them "fines" when you should understand by now that they are just speculative invoices. Note that in the argument that @Coupon-mad has provided you they are referred to as "charges".

    Also, you do not address and sign a serious communication with "Regards". These are not your chums. They are scammers out to fleece you out of your money. You address correspondence to these people with "Dear Sir/Madam" and you sign off with "Yours faithfully".

    Signing off with "Regards", you might as well use "Love and kisses".
  • raburgess1
    raburgess1 Posts: 27
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite
    edited 21 December 2023 at 1:33PM
    All points noted above. Email in post has been amended to suit.
  • I would be welcome for any additional comments if anyone has anything to suggest.
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 129,195
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    Forumite
    edited 23 December 2023 at 1:10AM
    When I saiid "do it this week" (on 4th Dec) and '"only give them 7 days" it was for legal reasons.  

    For a CCJ set aside case the Judge requires that you act promptly. That's an important legal consideration.

    Your application will end up dated January now. Hoping you can explain why, to the Judge at your hearing because this could be the difference in getting the CCJ set aside, or not.

    You ignored a claim form so you are already on a sticky wicket with this one and need to do everything right to have any chance.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • raburgess1
    raburgess1 Posts: 27
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite
    edited 22 December 2023 at 4:33PM
    Only the break-up of a long term relationship (imagine that's quite easy to explain to a court when you're having to sell your home etc).

    Thanks for the comments all the same and I do appreciate the time you take to answer.
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 129,195
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    Forumite
    edited 23 December 2023 at 1:11AM
    Only the break-up of a long term relationship (imagine that's quite easy to explain to a court when you're having to sell your home etc).

    Thanks for the comments all the same and I do appreciate the time you take to answer.
    I'm so sorry to hear that. Wishing you a much happier New Year, new start, and hopefully CCJ set aside.  Date the application in December.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
Meet your Ambassadors

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 341.7K Banking & Borrowing
  • 249.7K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 449K Spending & Discounts
  • 233.8K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 606K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 172.4K Life & Family
  • 246.7K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 15.8K Discuss & Feedback
  • 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards