Lets All Ask For Our Cca!

rog2

A further, and very valid, point is that simply by requesting the copy of the original consumer credit agreement, the 'debtor' is placing the 'alleged debt' into dispute. Creditors, or their Debt Collection Agencies, should, but seldom do, cease 'chasing' a 'debt' which is in dispute, as this is contrary to the Office of Fair Trading's Debt Collection Guidelines to which Debt Collectors should adhere:

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/consumer_credit/oft664.pdf

Tootsie_Roll

rog2 wrote: »

A further, and very valid, point is that simply by requesting the copy of the original consumer credit agreement, the 'debtor' is placing the 'alleged debt' into dispute.

This is inaccurate and potentially misleading.

By that measure all collection activity would have to stop every time someone raised the smallest dispute - just a ridiculous notion to even contemplate. From a lenders perspective debtors are always trying to muddy the waters with anything they think may hold up proceedings - this would be just another one of those tactics and without doubt would fail if it ever went to court and was used as a defence (although practically this would never happen because the CCA would have to be produced before the court date anyway).

In addition where is the 'dispute' just because you are requesting a copy of the agreement ? You may just have lost it. The only time this 'dispute' would work is if you genuinely don't believe the debt is yours. In fact that is the only circumstance where this letter is appropriate anyway - for anything else it is just another attempt at debt avoidance and definately should not be condoned by a site like this.

rog2

Tootsie_Roll wrote: »

This is inaccurate and potentially misleading.

You don't seem to like it when I refer to the Guidelines laid down by the Office of Fair Trading, to which the 'dubious' profession of 'Debt Collection', which you represent, should, but seldom does, adhere.

MagsyB

I have to agree with Tootsie (well I dont have to but I will )

We tried this a few years ago thinking the same thing - that if they dont supply the information then the debt would be written off.
It was a complete waste of time. We got a couple back and couple more ignored us and one just said that if we thought that it wasnt our debt then why had we been paying. So they called our bluff - if we didnt pay and they took it to court they would claim against us because we had been paying and so had acknowledged the debt without the paperwork.
The only way we found was to bite the bullet and pay - all be it reduced full and finals but these would have been the same as claiming back the charges now.

So the bottom line - again - if you spent the money then the only true way of getting rid of the debt is to pay it back.

Magsy

rog2

MagsyB wrote: »

We tried this a few years ago thinking the same thing - that if they dont supply the information then the debt would be written off.

To be fair, Magsy, NOBODY - especially me, is saying that not supplying a true copy of the original cca will 'write off any 'alleged debt'.
If a creditor or DCA (it does not matter if it is the original lender or not) is asked, by an alleged debtor, for a true copy of the original consumer credit agreement, then that creditor/dca has a legal obligation, under the terms of the Consumer Credit Act, 1974, to provide that cca within a prescribed time frame.
If that creditor, or dca, fails to supply the requested cca, within the legally allowed time frame, then the agreement to which the cca relates is no longer enforceable unless the creditor/dca applies to a court for an order to enforce the agreement. A court may, or may not, grant such an order, but the alleged debtor would, in his defence, have the right to tell that court that he had requested a true copy of the original cca, but this had not been supplied within the legally allowed time frame. This will, in effect, render the original agreement irrideemably unenforceable.
The other, maybe not so small, point is that if a creditor/dca fails to provide the alleged debtor with a copy of the original cca within 30 days of the expiry of the 12 working days, during which they should supply the document, then that creditor/dca has, actually, comitted a criminal offence.
One thing that requesting a copy of the cca does achieve is to establish the 'validity' of any 'alleged debt'. Some Debt Collection Agencies are, shall we say, less than economic with the true facts surrounding some of the 'alleged debts' which they are attempting to collect. Even, shock horror, some would be, at the least, reticent when it comes to explaining, to an alleged debtor, what actual rights that 'alleged debtor' may have in law.

If a creditor, or debt collector, does supply a true copy of the original consumer credit agreement, deed of assignment and full statement of the account, within the legally allowed time frame, and that the said documentation proves, to the satisfaction of all concerned, that the 'alleged debt' is indeed genuine, then, of course the debtor should try to reach an agreement with the original creditor/dca to repay the debt in a manner that the debtor can afford. This may be by instalment or, as in your case, by negociating a 'full and final' settlement and there are Debt Counselling Charities, such as CAB, CCCS or National Debtline, who will be pleased to suggest the best solution for an individual debtor.

Again, to try and pressurise a debtor into an agreement which he is unlikely to be able to afford is considered as 'unfair practice' by the Office of Fair Trading.

stapeley

Thankyou for your reply rog2 . As i said before if we all asked for a cca , surely lots would slip the net ! It well worth it !

stapeley

If people were to read the whole of the post , and the cc Act you will see where i,m coming from ! IF THEY CAN NOT PRODUCE THE REQUIRED PAPERWORK , ANY CLAIM WOULD BE THROWN OUT OF COURT !

Tootsie_Roll

rog2 wrote: »

You don't seem to like it when I refer to the Guidelines laid down by the Office of Fair Trading, to which the 'dubious' profession of 'Debt Collection', which you represent, should, but seldom does, adhere.

Once again misquoting me in respect to the guidelines. You haven't answered the pertinent question which is - Why is there a dispute just because you have requested a copy of the CCA unless as part of the request you state that you know nothing about the debt at all because it isn't you ?

gilligansyle

Hi, I did this with Lovells who were chasing a debt for someone, who bought it off someone else etc. They said that I had to make a payment as proof of willingness to pay before they would send it. I refused because I was not sure the debt was mine or my ex's. Eventually after 10 weeks they sent me the original agreement. All that proved was that I had taken it out, I am now disputing that there was a balance owing or that the balance is as stated. If I do owe them all it does is buy me some time while I trawl through bank statements looking for all the transactions.

stapeley

Gilligansyle, if you followed the set procedure ,as laid down in the CC act ,and the company did not comply with the ACT . They would be in a very poor position if they tried to go to to court. My objection is that you have no control on who the debt is sold on to! So it is only reasonable that these third parties have to prove that they have the right to chase you for the debt . If they fail in there duty to comply with th CC ACT, then they have only them selves to blame.