Can a company insist you find cover before requesting a/l

hallmark

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

Undervalued

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

Yes and no!

An employer can totally dictate when you can and cannot take your leave or, by giving fairly minimal notice, force you to take it when they say. They do have to allow you to take your 5.6 weeks statutory holiday at some point in the year. You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

Nothing specifically says that they can (or can't) insist that you find cover, after all some employee of the company has to arrange the shifts so there is no obvious reason why that person can't at least partly be you.

If they have prevented you from taking your leave at some point in the year (of their choosing) then you cannot lawfully have to forfeit it. 

[Deleted User]

Undervalued said:

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

 You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

I wasn't aware of this... could you point me to the legislation please.

Hoenir

[Deleted User] said:

Undervalued said:

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

 You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

I wasn't aware of this... could you point me to the legislation please.

As any agreement has to be mutual. Doesn't require legislation. Normally such practices are documented in the Company policy handbook. 

Marcon

Hoenir said:

Major_Hazard said:

Undervalued said:

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

 You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

I wasn't aware of this... could you point me to the legislation please.

As any agreement has to be mutual. Doesn't require legislation. Normally such practices are documented in the Company policy handbook. 

See https://www.gov.uk/holiday-entitlement-rights/calculate-leave-entitlement

Undervalued

Major_Hazard said:

Undervalued said:

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

 You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

I wasn't aware of this... could you point me to the legislation please.

This is the info on the website of a well know HR firm (although there is a typeo  as the second bullet point should read 5.6 weeks and not six weeks).

Can holidays be carried over?

How staff are provided holidays in the UK is outlined below:

• Four weeks in line with EU law
• 6 weeks in line with UK law
• Any additional leave the employer wishes to provide

Usually, there's no statutory obligation on an employer to allow an employee to carry leave over to the following year, though this may not be the case where the employee has been on long term sick leave or maternity leave.

Leave may only be carried over if the employer gives the employee permission or if it's stated in the employment contract and/or staff handbook.

However, in the real world, I always advise employees to think very carefully before making a big fuss about holiday arrangements. Yes, you have a right to your 5.6 weeks paid holiday but if the employer wants to be difficult they can perfectly lawfully tell you to take it at the very least attractive times - such as every other Thursday or all of February plus a week and a bit in late November!

General_Grant

Major_Hazard said:

Undervalued said:

hallmark said:

A workplace near me (it's a leisure centre) has issued new guidance saying that if any of it's staff want a/l they must (it's very specific that the onus is on them) get agreement in writing from one of their colleagues that they will cover their shifts before submitting the a/l request. They also state that any unused a/l will be forfeited unpaid.

I'm no kind of legal expert but this seems extremely dubious practice to me and represents a real issue at this particular place as they are frequently short-staffed and getting cover is always a challenge. So could very easily lead to scenarios where people just cannot take the A/L they're entitled to (a/l entitlement is 5.6 weeks each year).

Does an employer have the ability to dictate this?

 You can however mutually agree to carry over up to 1.6 weeks of this.

I wasn't aware of this... could you point me to the legislation please.

To add to the link which Marcon has provided, the 1.6 weeks equates to 8 days for a 5-day/week employee.  That is equivalent to the normal number of bank holidays in England and , way back, was added to the 20 days under EU legislation.
(It's not that there is a right to bank holidays but simply because some employers who were already giving bank holidays were counting those days in the 4 weeks (20 days).  This was lawful at the time but not really the intention when the 4 weeks holiday entitlement was introduced.)

itsthelittlethings

They shouldn't be asking you to find cover if it's hard to find cover and means you risk not being able to take your leave. I would say they shouldn't be asking you to find cover for your own leave, this is a management job. If you are in a union call them, if not call ACAS for advice.

Holiday entitlement: Booking time off - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Here it says "Although employers can refuse to give leave at a certain time, they cannot refuse to let workers take the leave at all.". I would argue they are skating on very thin ice.

General_Grant

Ef79 said:

They shouldn't be asking you to find cover if it's hard to find cover and means you risk not being able to take your leave. I would say they shouldn't be asking you to find cover for your own leave, this is a management job. If you are in a union call them, if not call ACAS for advice.

Holiday entitlement: Booking time off - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Here it says "Although employers can refuse to give leave at a certain time, they cannot refuse to let workers take the leave at all.". I would argue they are skating on very thin ice.

If members of staff could not find holiday cover for their work and thus were denied leave, at the end of the company leave year the organisation would have everyone off at the same time with no cover.  Paying instead of allowing statutory paid leave is only legitimate when someone leaves the company without having taken all accrued holiday.

penners324

Just point out that if this isn't possible then all staff will take the final few weeks of the holiday year as holiday to ensure all lave is used up.

Leisure centre will be shut for 3 weeks by the sound of it