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Not giving 28 days annual leave is this something I should pursue?

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  • n1guy
    n1guy Posts: 698 Forumite
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    Did you get an offer letter before you started?  Ask for a copy of your contract which should show information about holiday entitlement, sick pay etc.

    As others have said the fact that you started part way through the holiday year you will only get a pro rata allowance this year.

    Any day taken as holiday is still treated as a day regardless of how many hours are worked in that day. So working 4.5 days a week still gives you 5 leave days, although paid as 4.5.  So you are entitled to 20 days statutory holiday days and 8 bank holidays in a full year.    If you can post the details of you leave year start, we can confirm your entitlement for this year.         
    Many companies insist annual leave is reserved for any Christmas close down.   If you don’t have enough pro rata entitlement you may have to take some unpaid leave if the office/factory is closed.
    No I got a phone call,  no contract or pension for that matter either.  Both legal requirements but hey ho here we are. 

    Yeah I’m aware pro rata etc, the business closes down so I simply wouldn’t get paid which would be fine by me, it’s not a case of I don’t have holidays accrued so can’t take them.  
  • stu12345_2
    stu12345_2 Posts: 1,576 Forumite
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    when you start a job, you accept the general terms of the job, it doesnt have to be in writing, it can be verbal, but the employer must produce a written contract within 2 months of starting.
     so your job is basically mon to friday with friday being optional.  So if you do always go in on a  friday they have to pay you 38 hrs  worth of holiday pay, cos you did the full mon to fri 38 hrs hours.

    Christians Against Poverty solved my debt problem, when all other debt charities failed. Give them a call !! ( You don't have to be a Christian ! )

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  • elsien
    elsien Posts: 35,058 Forumite
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    n1guy said:
    Caz3121 said:
    When does your leave year run? If jan-dec and you start part way through the year then it would be pro rata for the year. 5.6 weeks including bank holidays is the requirement. If your full time hours are spread over 4 days then your allowance would equate to 22.4 days (4 days x 5.6)
    Ah, so it is legal but sneaky.  This explains why the massive increase in condensed hour jobs then, so like a full time 40hr week job squashed into 3 days rather than 5, it allows them to give less leave. 

    But I am actually working 5 days and was never told anything about 4 days plus overtime , I was told 5 days
    I would suggest It’s not about the number of days it’s about the number of hours.

    So you are you contracted to do 38 hours  over the week that’s in four days, four and a half or five? 
    So if Friday is “optional” can you do your 38 hours Monday to Thursday in and not going in on the Friday? 
    And when you take a days annual leave, how many hours does it count as off your leave entitlement.
    FWIW I  used to work in a care home and would’ve been lucky to get three days in a row over Christmas and New Year. 
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
  • n1guy
    n1guy Posts: 698 Forumite
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    elsien said:
    n1guy said:
    Caz3121 said:
    When does your leave year run? If jan-dec and you start part way through the year then it would be pro rata for the year. 5.6 weeks including bank holidays is the requirement. If your full time hours are spread over 4 days then your allowance would equate to 22.4 days (4 days x 5.6)
    Ah, so it is legal but sneaky.  This explains why the massive increase in condensed hour jobs then, so like a full time 40hr week job squashed into 3 days rather than 5, it allows them to give less leave. 

    But I am actually working 5 days and was never told anything about 4 days plus overtime , I was told 5 days
    I would suggest It’s not about the number of days it’s about the number of hours.

    So you are you contracted to do 38 hours  over the week that’s in four days, four and a half or five? 
    So if Friday is “optional” can you do your 38 hours Monday to Thursday in and not going in on the Friday? 
    And when you take a days annual leave, how many hours does it count as off your leave entitlement.
    FWIW I  used to work in a care home and would’ve been lucky to get three days in a row over Christmas and New Year. 
    I do it over 5 days. That’s what I was told personally I work 5 days.  The other employees tell me it’s optional. So in theory then if I have to do 5 days I should be entitled to 28 while they 21 can’t see that happening.  

    I’ve never taken a day off can can’t comment.  I wouldn’t get paid anyway as not there long enough.

    Yeah I know I’m lucky to have Christmas off but it’s the nature of the work, I can’t take off when I like when my partner is off for example as holidays are set so it’s swings and roundabouts I guess
  • stu12345_2
    stu12345_2 Posts: 1,576 Forumite
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    edited 12 November 2023 at 10:27AM
    "I would suggest It’s not about the number of days it’s about the number of hours".

    very very true, it isnt so much the worked days, its the total number of hours, if you worked only 2 days a week but somehow managed to do 20 hours  work a day each, you would be entitled to 40 hours worth of leave ( which is the 2 days) cos its 5.6 weeks times your normal number of weekly HOURS !

    plus remember  the 8 days bank hols dont need to be given actual time off, but employer has to give you 8 days worth of money.
    Christians Against Poverty solved my debt problem, when all other debt charities failed. Give them a call !! ( You don't have to be a Christian ! )

    https://capuk.org/contact-us
  • n1guy
    n1guy Posts: 698 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    when you start a job, you accept the general terms of the job, it doesnt have to be in writing, it can be verbal, but the employer must produce a written contract within 2 months of starting.
     so your job is basically mon to friday with friday being optional.  So if you do always go in on a  friday they have to pay you 38 hrs  worth of holiday pay, cos you did the full mon to fri 38 hrs hours.

    So as far as I’m concerned I was told I work Monday to Friday, nothing was ever mentioned to me by management of Friday being optional, this came from other employees. Now next year I can see the fall out occurring they getting 21
    days while me looking 28.  Hence why I think I’m better cutting my losses sooner rather that later really
  • la531983
    la531983 Posts: 2,542 Forumite
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    edited 12 November 2023 at 10:30AM
    If they aren't offering you a workplace pension you likely need to report them to HMRC, although not sure if there is a minimum employee number requirement. 
  • stu12345_2
    stu12345_2 Posts: 1,576 Forumite
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    edited 12 November 2023 at 10:34AM
    why would you only want to do mon to thu and get less holiday entitlement, just do the mon to friday and get the full 38 hrs a week worth of hols, the full 28 days.  also you can get more than 28 days worth of money, as an employer has to look at the total hours worked in the  last 12 weeks, and if there O/Time, you get more holiday pay money
    Christians Against Poverty solved my debt problem, when all other debt charities failed. Give them a call !! ( You don't have to be a Christian ! )

    https://capuk.org/contact-us
  • elsien
    elsien Posts: 35,058 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 12 November 2023 at 10:33AM
    n1guy said:
    when you start a job, you accept the general terms of the job, it doesnt have to be in writing, it can be verbal, but the employer must produce a written contract within 2 months of starting.
     so your job is basically mon to friday with friday being optional.  So if you do always go in on a  friday they have to pay you 38 hrs  worth of holiday pay, cos you did the full mon to fri 38 hrs hours.

    So as far as I’m concerned I was told I work Monday to Friday, nothing was ever mentioned to me by management of Friday being optional, this came from other employees. Now next year I can see the fall out occurring they getting 21
    days while me looking 28.  Hence why I think I’m better cutting my losses sooner rather that later really
    Forget what are the other employees are telling you, what does your manager/HR say? 
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
  • n1guy
    n1guy Posts: 698 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    why would you only want to do mon to thu and get less holiday entitlement, just do the mon to friday and get the full 38 hrs a week worth of hols, the full 28 days.  also you can get more than 28 days, as an employer has to look at the total hours worked in the  last 12 weeks, and if there O/Time, you get more holiday pay money
    You’re getting near the point I am trying to make but many aren’t picking up on.  I agree with you.  The point being even with doing 38 hrs you’re not getting 28 days as the Friday they are classing as overtime and not counting as full time hours and only giving 21 days holidays.  
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