Parking Charge Notice (Residential) - PCM - Appeal already rejected. Next steps - info in thread

benditlikebeckham

Hi

A parking charge notice was put on my car about 2.5 weeks ago. I appealed this - I was going on holiday so wanted to do this before I left so did not look on this message board, which will probably now make things a bit more difficult. I wrote the below:-

I am appealing this parking charge as I feel that it was primarily issued unfairly amongst other things. As you can see from the photos taken by your employee, the permit is clearly visible in the windscreen. However, it is turned over. This was not done on purpose. I had thought when I put the permit on the dashboard on the night of 17th August that it was facing with the permit number showing. The only explanation I have was that it was windy and the permit may have flipped over as I closed the door. In any case, it's clear from the writing on the back that this is a PCM parking permit. I believe no action was necessary or at most a written note to say to turn it over would have sufficed as this was not done intentionally and I did not know that it was upside down. If your employee would come to check now they will clearly see it is that same permit. I hope this matter can be resolved by withdrawing the fine in full. I look forward to hearing from you shortly.

Kind regards,

X

I would say that I have not identified the driver just that I was the person who placed the permit on the dashboard. Although it could be argued I suppose. 

The scenario is as follows:

• Car parked in a residential parking bay. I had the visitor permit, which was face down.
  
• My partner lives at the flat and uses the car. The tenancy agreement makes no mention of parking. My understanding is that the permits were given to her by the landlord for them to use.
• Permit clearly visible on the dashboard, but upside down (photographed by operative).
• I can't post a picture, but the PCM parking sign says:- 1. vehicles must display a valid PCM permit clearly in the windscreen. 2. marked bays - valid PC resident or PC visitor Permit. There are three other points, but they are not relevant.
  
• The usual retrospective evidence of authority to park will not be accepted - I think I have read somewhere that the courts are looking to remove this and it should be accepted.
• Signs are probably clear enough, but need to go back and check.
• My partner's tenancy ends this weekend so I do not know if that will complicate things as I will have no access to the permit after this weekend.
• I do not know who owns the car park, but my partner tells me it is PCM - how do I check who the owner is/is PCM really likely to be the owner?

I read somewhere on here that someone lost in court having an upside down ticket so is it worth pursuing this?

I received the usual PCM letter that has been posted before that the hologram was not visible. Although I do need to check this as the permit had started to curl so I need to see if it could be visible from another angle, but let's assume it is not. I won't be able to test this straightaway because I'm not going to take my car to my partner's place for a few days. It seems as if the PCM signs have been updated as they don't include the word forbidden etc.

Is it worth waiting for NTK or LBC? My partner wants me to pay the fine - today is the last day to pay the reduced £60.

I can put in all the usual arguments of why would I photocopy it if there is a hologram as that would be futile so the logic does not stand. It also does not say on the sign which way up the permit should be etc. My partner is speaking to the landlord today, but I don't think the landlord will do anything.

Grateful for thoughts on this one.

Coupon-mad

Just ignore PCM now until you've a court claim because there's no real appeal.

No harm done to dispute it like you did, but do not try IAS.

Sit tight.

DO NOT TAKE THE BAIT OF THE DEMANDS.

Laugh at the £170 threatograms.

Search the forum for PCM Watchdog (change the search to NEWEST) and learn from all the other PCM threads.

Ask yourself why on earth anyone who owns a flat there is acceding like sheep to a rip-off money-making scheme purely designed to target residents and visitors.

Completely unnecessary at anyone's home residential car park. Amazes me that residents don't even Google PCM's reputation and let it happen!  I'm talking about her landlord the leaseholder really.  Utter madness to let PCM in to do this to tenants.

benditlikebeckham

Thanks for the response. I am sitting tight (albeit under heavy pressure from partner to pay it)!

• Permits provided by PCM to Landlord. Landlord then gives it to tenant.
• Got partner to check with landlord who said she can't do anything. Will wait for court letter.

benditlikebeckham

Expecting a letter shortly to say the PCN is now £170. Is it worth replying to that letter to state that I'm happy for this to be taken to court as I don't really want any debt recovery companies coming around to my house and hassling my family. I could also state a few more reasons why they should just drop this PCN or should I just sit tight and wait for the appropriate letters?

If the debt recovery company does come around I can just state that I am fine for this to be taken to court and for them to not come around again (assuming I am at home). 

KeithP

benditlikebeckham said:

Expecting a letter shortly to say the PCN is now £170. Is it worth replying to that letter to state that I'm happy for this to be taken to court as I don't really want any debt recovery companies coming around to my house and hassling my family.

If the debt recovery company does come around... 

No debt collector, or anyone else will be calling at your house about this issue.

Please re-read the first line of the first reply you received on this thread.
In fact, read the whole of that first reply again. There's good information there.

Coupon-mad

But you CAN reply saying go straight to court if you think you have a case.  I know that PCM were exposed on Watchdog/Rogue Traders a few years back, so don't harass me.  Don't add the laughably extortionate £70 that the DLUHC is surely about to ban.  PCM get your act together and learn sharpish what a real consumer service ethic means, otherwise plenty of dodgy ex-wheelclampers will be banned within a year, at this rate.

Grizebeck

benditlikebeckham said:

Expecting a letter shortly to say the PCN is now £170. Is it worth replying to that letter to state that I'm happy for this to be taken to court as I don't really want any debt recovery companies coming around to my house and hassling my family. I could also state a few more reasons why they should just drop this PCN or should I just sit tight and wait for the appropriate letters?

If the debt recovery company does come around I can just state that I am fine for this to be taken to court and for them to not come around again (assuming I am at home). 

Why do you think a debt collector for a unpaid pcn will call round.
Please provide evidence 

Coupon-mad

Did you miss the NEWBIES thread post 4?

No-one comes knocking.

B789

benditlikebeckham said:

 I don't really want any debt recovery companies coming around to my house and hassling my family.

benditlikebeckham

Thank you for the responses - they did make me chuckle. 

Haven't received anything now since 27th November - do they generally take things further if no communication for this length of time or am I just looking to receive a letter some time in the next 6 years.

Interestingly, I was driving past where the ticket was issued and noticed that PCN have now been removed from that area so no more 'enforcement' from them. Is there anything to read into that? Amazingly, the solution was to install a gate that only opens for registered vehicles...if only they did that earlier!