UPDATE: Why "New Style ESA", when I am should be on UC with LCWRA?

RealGem

Hi, I moved from Wales to England and was told weeks ago by UC that I would change from ESA (Contrubution Based / Support Group) to UC with LCWRA.

I was also told I would not need to go for another medical assessment until at least 2024, poss 2025.

Now I have a letter saying my Contrubution Based ESA is changing to the New Style ESA.

But it contradicts itself:

On the first page it says 
"Your contribution based ESA will change to new style ESA..." etc

Then overleaf, it says: 

"Your award of Income related ESA will end on Aug 20th..."


I always understood that I was on Income related, not contribution based. 

Why is this letter claiming I was on BOTH types of ESA?

Thanks



And the letter says I must attend an appointment, either at the local job centre or on the phone. Is this a medical assessment?




Also, I heard the new style ESA is less money than what I was on. 

I am already struggling to buy food and basics. Will I be on an even lower income?

And have they made a mistake? I was told I would be on UC and not ESA at all. 

Thank you

kaMelo

New style ESA is contributions based ESA by a different name.
You will not be moved to UC automatically, you will need to start a claim for UC yourself.  As you are already in the support group of ESA, upon claiming UC you would receive LCWRA from day one although you would have to tell them to add this to your claim.
You can claim ESA and UC simultaneously however this will not result in you being better off as any ESA received would be deducted in full from UC

Alice_Holt

kaMelo said:

You can claim ESA and UC simultaneously however this will not result in you being better off as any ESA received would be deducted in full from UC

      I wonder if the OP would ultimately be better off under UC.  Since the LCWRA element of £390 pm is greater than the £45 pw Support Group component.

      This assumes no SDP is currently in payment.

   Of course the minimum 5 week wait for the first UC payment may be an issue for the OP.
   
     

RealGem

Alice_Holt said:

kaMelo said:

You can claim ESA and UC simultaneously however this will not result in you being better off as any ESA received would be deducted in full from UC

      I wonder if the OP would ultimately be better off under UC.  Since the LCWRA element of £390 pm is greater than the £45 pw Support Group component.

      This assumes no SDP is currently in payment.

   Of course the minimum 5 week wait for the first UC payment may be an issue for the OP.
   
     

Thanks. I'm in week 3 of the 5 week wait for UC. And I had a loan advanced payment so I am able to pay bills for now. I had to make a claim for UC as I moved house a long way, and was told I had to, as it was a change in circs. 

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

Basically after rent and coucil tax was paid I had £149 a week to live on. 

Thanks

poppy12345

RealGem said:

Alice_Holt said:

kaMelo said:

You can claim ESA and UC simultaneously however this will not result in you being better off as any ESA received would be deducted in full from UC

      I wonder if the OP would ultimately be better off under UC.  Since the LCWRA element of £390 pm is greater than the £45 pw Support Group component.

      This assumes no SDP is currently in payment.

   Of course the minimum 5 week wait for the first UC payment may be an issue for the OP.
   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

RealGem

   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

Sorry yes I meant EDP was a bit more than the basic rate. Now I see it looks stupid the way I said it! 

Yes, single. So are you saying I will get £129.50 a week ESA + at least £20 from UC on top? Thanks



And what is this appointment they say I must attend? Is it a medical assessment?

Thank you

poppy12345

RealGem said:

   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

Yes, single. So are you saying I will get £129.50 a week ESA + at least £20 from UC on top? Thanks

No, that's not what i said for UC. Your UC will include the following elements, assuming you're single...

standard allowace £368.74/month (assuming 25 and over) 

+ LCWRA element £390.06/month 

+ housing element?? ( no idea how much that is for you)

Your ESA will be deducted in full which will be £561.16/month. Total UC payable (without housing element) £197.64/month. You need to add the housing on top of that amount.

You will also have your ESA which will be £259/fortnight. 

Therefore you're much better off than you were when claim just ESA. This is because LCWRA for UC pays more than ESA Support Group, without the SDP.

Your appointment will be the standard new claims appointment at your local job centre. It is not a medical assessment.

You should also tell them (if you haven't already) that you're in the Support Group for ESA. Once this information has been updated you will have no further appointments.

Spoonie_Turtle

poppy12345 said:

RealGem said:

   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

Yes, single. So are you saying I will get £129.50 a week ESA + at least £20 from UC on top? Thanks

You should also tell them (if you haven't already) that you're in the Support Group for ESA. Once this information has been updated you will have no further appointments.

Just going to highlight this, it's important that you do so because UC and ESA are on different systems that don't always communicate with each other.  So to give yourself the best chance of getting everything you're entitled to on your first UC payment, it's best you tell them explicitly as soon as you can after claiming.

This will also ensure you don't get called for a medical assessment as part of your new UC claim. 
(There's a tiny possibility they might coincidentally decide it's time for a review for you, but it wouldn't be because you've claimed UC.)

poppy12345

Spoonie_Turtle said:

poppy12345 said:

RealGem said:

   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

Yes, single. So are you saying I will get £129.50 a week ESA + at least £20 from UC on top? Thanks

You should also tell them (if you haven't already) that you're in the Support Group for ESA. Once this information has been updated you will have no further appointments.

Just going to highlight this, it's important that you do so because UC and ESA are on different systems that don't always communicate with each other.  So to give yourself the best chance of getting everything you're entitled to on your first UC payment, it's best you tell them explicitly as soon as you can after claiming.

Most definitely. It would also be very helpful if you can take a copy of an ESA letter with you to the appointee (if you're attending in person)

RealGem

poppy12345 said:

RealGem said:

   
     

I was not on SDP, but I was on Enhanced Disability Premium which was a bit more. 

That's not correct. EDP is less per week than SDP. As your ESA didn't include the SDP then UC with the LCWRA element will actually pay more than your ESA did.

As part of your ESA was contributions based this will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. Your new ESA amount will be £129.50/week.

Yes, your ESA going forward will be less than what you were previously receiving but you'll also have your UC payments one a month. Your UC will include standard allowance, LCWRA element and housing element (assuming you're single)

Yes, single. So are you saying I will get £129.50 a week ESA + at least £20 from UC on top? Thanks

No, that's not what i said for UC. Your UC will include the following elements, assuming you're single...

standard allowace £368.74/month (assuming 25 and over) 

+ LCWRA element £390.06/month 

+ housing element?? ( no idea how much that is for you)

Your ESA will be deducted in full which will be £561.16/month. Total UC payable (without housing element) £197.64/month. You need to add the housing on top of that amount.

You will also have your ESA which will be £259/fortnight. 

Therefore you're much better off than you were when claim just ESA. This is because LCWRA for UC pays more than ESA Support Group, without the SDP.

Your appointment will be the standard new claims appointment at your local job centre. It is not a medical assessment.

You should also tell them (if you haven't already) that you're in the Support Group for ESA. Once this information has been updated you will have no further appointments.

Thank you, that is very reassuring. 

@Spoonie_Turtle and @poppy12345

I am certain one of them acknowledged that I was in the Support Group on the ohone recently, but I have told them in my UC journal now as well. 

Thank you

RealGem

Hi, 

I continued to get paid ESA at £298.10 on the following dates:

01/08/2023
16/08/2023
29/08/2023

I only started claiming UC on August 7th, so I thought my ESA would stop from that date. 

I assumed a mistake had been made with the extra payments, so I made sure all the ESA money was still in my account in case they asked for it back. And I was paying bills out of the Advanced Payment I got from UC. 

My UC account now says this: 

"Your payment this month is £643

This will be paid by 8pm on 13 September 2023

Standard allowance  £368.74

You get a standard amount each month. You said you're single

Housing  £524.68

You said per month the total rent for your property is £345.80 and the service charges are £178.88.

You will have to pay your housing costs to your landlord.

Limited capability for work and work-related activity  £390.06

You said your health affects you at work or prevents you from working

Total entitlement before deductions  £1,283.48

What we take off (deductions)

Other benefits We take money off your payment

As you received benefits you were not entitled to

Employment and Support Allowance
minus‑ £25.14

As this is an average of other benefits that you're continuing to claim

Employment and Support Allowance

minus‑ £561.17

Advance Payments

minus‑ £53.49

Total deductions

minus‑ £639.80

Your total payment for this month is  £643.68 "

I can't get them to reply on my UC journal. I told them I got my ESA letter over a week ago. 

I don't understand why the deductions are what they say,

(especially the £25.14 thay say I wasn't entitled to. I am hoping that won't be deducted every month??)


I added up the amount of ESA that I have been overpaid for this month as being 
2 x 298.10 = £596.20

And as I was overpaid only ONE week of ESA after Aug 7th, that should be £149.05
(give or take for a day or two for the difference of 28 days vs a calendar month. My brain aint doing THAT!)

So let's say I was overpaid 
£596.20 + 
£149.05
_______
£745.25

But they took £639.80 off me. So that's £105.45 difference in my favour... but not when they ask for it back!


So from reading the above repsonses it seems that I will be on the same money whether I'm on all-UC or both UC and ESA. 

But I have ADHD and I'm very confused. (It's taken me over an hour just to compile all of this info for example).

I would prefer to be on ALL Universal Credit, so I can see at a glance what I am on. 

Can I get this to happen? It seems silly to be paid from two different departments (UC and ESA) that don't appear to talk to each other.
(The amount of £298.10 per fortnight that I got off ESA did include the Enhanced Disability Premium)


And if anyone can see anything I've missed in this post's info, please let me know! 


Summary:
1. Can I request to be on ONLY Universal Credit?
2. Will I have £25.14 deducted each month? (and why)

Thank you