A few legal questions re employment law/tribunals etc

Jude57

Dakta said:

Not really pick any but consider all opinions on their merits, and give way to further research perhaps -  I also don't want to invoke solicitors unless I'm actually in a case (we're sort of not there yet). That makes pricey research, and research, theoretical is where we're at.

To be fair to you, I have actually attempted the highstreets in my area because it could become something - they have actually been rather useless, offer a spam can deal or settlement negotiation but act like a rabbit in the headlights when you pose a specific question. Maybe i just got unlucky (ha) but I generally rate the expertise here. 

Do you have anything useful/in scope to add? I say that because I see this argument come up a lot, not just for legal stuff (which I admit in a case can be a little bit risque) but on a discussion forum around employment, what is the real harm in actually discussing it? (ie we see a lot of 'consult your union!' - well yeah we can do that when we get there, I just want to discuss it.  It's through discussion many a valid point gets noted (and can go to the solicitors/union as the formal response if it warrants it). But that doesn't invalidate discussion. You might want that second opinion or consensus to give you something to go to the solicitor with. 

We're also assuming solicitors are helpful in this context which is...unfortunately a separate argument. I can't say it's a wholesale issue but previously even paid advice has been rather wanting, it's worrying when you highlight something to a solicitor and they act surprised. But hey ho. 

I don't really want the thread to get pulled down by people who can't/won't add anything useful trying to sort of justify their vacuum by saying I should consult someone else. I don't see my question as unreasonable as it's an invite for comment, not legal advice, even though it's on a legal matter.

Can I just recommend, on behalf of Union workplace representatives (unpaid, often under-trained and under-supported by all concerned, volunteers), Union full-time, paid officers and caseworkers, that if you are a member in good standing (i.e. not suspended from membership and not in arrears with your subscriptions) you involve your Union at the very earliest possible stage of any employment issue. Your workplace representatives know your employer, know the employer's policies and practices, know what likelihood there is of a reasonable outcome for your concerns. They will tell you whether you have a legitimate grievance or whether you're being unreasonable. If they agree you have a case, they'll do the work for you to research whether it's worth escalating to full-time, expert officers and/or seeking legal advice from the expert employment solicitors the Union keeps on retainer at which point, if they agree you have a case (and especially if your issue affects or could affect other members in your workplace or others) they will represent you at Tribunal and, if necessary, pursue appeals. If they don't think you have a case, or at least a good chance of success, they'll tell you so. All that is covered by your membership. Why on earth wouldn't you involve them as soon as possible?

One further point to bear in mind. If you seek legal advice from outside the Union, you may well find that the Union will refuse to represent you. That's what is written in your membership terms and I've seen it happen many times. The only case I can recall where the member sought outside legal advice and representation but came back to the Union and they took the matter forward was many years ago and had national ramifications for thousands of other members (it was an equal pay issue).

Dakta

Hi - thanks for your post.

As you can probably guess, I am not in a union - though that's not to say I'm not in dialog with one, for obvious reasons they can't get involved directly but have actually been quite good in providing snippets and resources to sort of help myself, nothing tangible but avenues to explore for assistance etc.. 

However it's probably the route I'd go down had it been available (I wasn't even aware of an unions covering my area) so if anyone reading this isn't in a union - it's fair enough to say consider it.

I'll caveat it - since starting the thread I have been approached by someone with some experience with  and we're still going over fundamentals but we've touched on Unions/ACAS and the CAB and one thing commented on is the quality of the advice can vary, so being union represented does mean you're going to get help but experiences do ultimately vary as well. Arguably the same caveats apply with other assistance guidance and representation too, so i think your advice is sound, but I'd apply the usual caution of doing some homework yourself as well and always keep a critical eye not only on the allegations laid against you, but also the people representing you. If your knowledge suggests something isn't getting enough emphasis, or points are going unraised it's so much easier to be raising this with your advocates before any hearing. 

bargainbetty

I can't offer any legal advice, not being a trained solicitor/barrister, but having worked within the legal world for some time, please note that 'high-street' law firms will not have the specific knowledge to advise on much more than settlements and negotiations thereof. If you want good legal advice on a specific employment matter, invest some time and money in a consultation with a specialist employment firm. 

Dakta

Thanks - what you say completely marries with what I'm finding, which is - to be absolutely honest - not what i expected but I'm sort of happy to learn - when we first spoke to ACAS they recommended a solicitor for advice, as did other people on another forum I use, but when we tried it was underwhelming to say the least, so much so an evening on google had us pretty much on par with knowing what they were going to tell us, but not answering the real sort of questions we had which we though a solicitor would have some experience with. (google is informative but it's not the same as experience).


One of the best advisors so far has been someone who consults with a HR firm - they aren't legal advisors but they've spent enough time dealing with tribunals they seem to know their salt which is where I'm leaning at the moment. 

I would at the moment, where employment is concerned, be wary of the 'get a solicitor' line at the moment if you want to try and do things as well as you can