Solar Panel Export Rates and fixed Standing Charge costs

Robbark66

I have just finished a "Tesla Octopus" tariff where power was bought and SOLD at 8.3p/kWh.

Now I have been put on "Flexible " which is 30.3p Import and 4.1p EXPORT. I have researched this and the wholesale price is circa 11.5p/kWh at the moment. WHY has OFGEM put the "price Cap" at 4.1p (inc VAT SO ACTUALLY 3.6p/kWh). Home owners exporting power are bing ripped off and will never see a sensible return on their investment at these levels. Octopus is making 26.7p/kWh PROFIT out of power I am making!

Secondly, part of the new 47p/day CS is to cover  Electricity Companies who have gone BUST. That should be NOTHING to do with my tariff. It's like me getting everyone in the country to chip in to pay losses from a business going bust on me. It's absolutely wrong!

It seems all the suppliers are paying the minimum and charging the maximum and Ofgem are NOT controlling them, they are all in cahoots and Ofgem is probably part of that. We are being taken to the cleaners and this sort of behaviour only fuels inflation and benefits the energy company CEOs.
 

DougMLancs

I suggest you do more research. Octopus Outgoing Fixed pays 15p/kWh or there’s Octopus Flux that varies slightly by region but pays 19p/kWh daytime and 31p/kWh between 4pm and 7pm. They’ve also recently released their intelligent flux tariff which has some similarities with the Tesla tariff in that import and export are charged at equal rates.
https://octopus.energy/press/smarter-cleaner-cheaper-octopus-launches-new-smart-tariff-to-unlock-solar-and-storage/

badmemory

He who pays the piper calls the tune & who pays ofgem?

dunstonh

Secondly, part of the new 47p/day CS is to cover  Electricity Companies who have gone BUST. That should be NOTHING to do with my tariff. It's like me getting everyone in the country to chip in to pay losses from a business going bust on me. It's absolutely wrong!

It happens in all many walks of life where there is widespread consumer protection.   One of my biggest bills for my company is to cover the firms that have gone bust.   That in turn is passed to the consumer.

It seems all the suppliers are paying the minimum and charging the maximum and Ofgem are NOT controlling them, they are all in cahoots and Ofgem is probably part of that. We are being taken to the cleaners and this sort of behaviour only fuels inflation and benefits the energy company CEOs.

If that was the case, then they would be making profit and not losses.

Dolor

they are all in cahoots

That I doubt given that it would be against UK Competition Law which could result in a maximum fine of 10% of global turnover, and unlimited financial penalties and imprisonment of up to 5 years against individuals.

The fact is that the original Tesla Energy Plan was a very good deal. That said, I have made over £500 exporting to the Grid since Flux was introduced in April.

I am not sure why you think that you shouldn’t contribute towards the cost of failed suppliers. I would suggest that an 80 year old who has been with BG since the days of electricity privatisation might have a stronger case not to pay towards the cost of failed suppliers.

Why not admit it? You are just unhappy because Tesla has pulled the TEP from the market. A form of TEP is expected back in the next year or so: I suspect though that it will not mirror the deal that you were on.

QrizB

badmemory said:

He who pays the piper calls the tune & who pays ofgem?

We all do, via our taxes.

Ofgem is a non-departmental public body controlled by the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero.

QrizB

Robbark66 said:

I have just finished a "Tesla Octopus" tariff where power was bought and SOLD at 8.3p/kWh.

That was an excellent scheme but Tesla and Octopus have parted ways.

Tesla are setting up their own UK energy company and might eventually offer something similar.

Now I have been put on "Flexible " which is 30.3p Import and 4.1p EXPORT. I have researched this ...

You might want to do a bit more research, starting with your own Octopus account.

Octopus have at least half a dozen different import tariffs, and Flexible is simply the default option.

Flexible does not include an export tariff.

Octopus offer at least four different export tariffs (SEG, Fixed, Agile and Flux) and I suspect you have been put on SEG, again as a default.

Robbark66 said:

WHY has OFGEM put the "price Cap" at 4.1p (inc VAT SO ACTUALLY 3.6p/kWh).

There is no 4.1p Ofgem cap.

Is your domestic energy system operated by a VAT-registered entity? If not, the VAT comment is meaningless.

Home owners exporting power are bing ripped off and will never see a sensible return on their investment at these levels.

It is rarely wise to make a multi-year investment decision on the basis of a 12-month offer. Now you know why.

Although, with a bit of care, a domestic solar PV system installed today can currently make better than 10%pa returns.

I think the other talking points in your opening post have already been adequately addressed.

Robbark66

Interesting comments..... However:
Octopus OUTGOING, FLUX and AGILE all have high import rates. I am using 14,000kWh /year, so the import tariff is far more important.

I have a Ltd Company, and don't pay anything towards "bust" companies, unless it comes from Corporation tax, which I doubt?

To run on Flux in the 4 longest day months would probably make a lot of sense, but at current rates, (especially North of the South Coast), export will drop to nothing very fast for the remaining 8 months, particularly if charging 2 cars and running a heat pump!

I'm VERY upset Tesla pulled the tariff-correct. I thought it very fair to pay the same import as export (at what ever the rate is). When installed, I was estimating a 7-8 year return, but that has been greatly reduced by having the Tesla Tariff savings.

I've done my research! They are trying to put me on Intelligent, but not every car is compatible (XC 40 Recharge Pure electric), Tesla is, and not every charger (Tesla wall charger x2). Once on Intelligent , I can use the power wall to spread the cost of the house by topping up in the middle of the night for a cloudy day. I'm not sure if the export will be able to be changed- I don't think so. If the export can go to FLUX and import Intelligent- that would be good.

There is a minimum cap on export set by Ofgem- currently 4.1p. I discovered that yesterday, new news to me!

QrizB

Robbark66 said:

Interesting comments..... However:
Octopus OUTGOING, FLUX and AGILE all have high import rates.

Wrong, I'm afraid.

Outgoing does not have an import tariff. The clue is in the name.

You do not have to take both Agile tariffs (incoming and outgoing), although Agile incoming is currently one of Octopus's cheapest import tariffs and is quite well suited to households with battery storage like your Powerwall.

Robbark66 said:

I am using 14,000kWh /year, so the import tariff is far more important.

I can see why you're upset about being asked to pay the market rate for your electricity - at the new EPG cap, that's £4k pa.

Robbark66 said:

I've done my research!

Seemingly not (see above and below).

Robbark66 said:

If the export can go to FLUX and import Intelligent- that would be good.

It would be good, but it's not possible. Flux is all-or-nothing.

Robbark66 said:

There is a minimum cap on export set by Ofgem- currently 4.1p. I discovered that yesterday, new news to me!

Link please?

Several suppliers (UW, Shell, E.ON, EDF) are paying less than 4p/kWh for export, if Ofgem have imposed a floor it will be of interest to customers of those suppliers.

mmmmikey

If you really have done your research perhaps you could explain why you have chosen to accept the standard export rate of 4.1p/kWh when you could switch to a rate of 15p/kWh with the same supplier? It seems like a strange choice.

Also, if you follow the news you'll be aware that energy prices have risen massively in recent years. Is there a reason you think those rises shouldn't affect you?

DougMLancs

If you go for Intelligent then you are limited to a 4.1p/kWh export rate but solely because they obviously don’t want people importing at 7.5p/kWh and then exporting it at 15p/kWh. You can switch tariffs easily so depending on your EV usage over the summer, you can do some sums to compare if you’d be better off on Flux for April-June say and then switching to Intelligent for the rest of the year or staying on Intelligent throughout the year. 

FYI tariffs like Intelligent are actually loss leaders for Octopus.