Price per kWh on prepay meter

Robin9

I am thinking this is a private meter belonging to the landlord. As such he is not allowed to make a profit but can recover the costs of the installation .

Did she get either the £150 or £400 last year ?

QrizB

Robin9 said:

I am thinking this is a private meter belonging to the landlord. As such he is not allowed to make a profit but can recover the costs of the installation.

I was thinking exactly the same. Landlord sub-meters are rarely coin slot machines these days, private smart meters are becoming common. It's more convenient for everyone.

The link on the previous page to the user guide is hosted on meterpay.net which is, I think, one of these services.

OP do the meter menus display any other tariff detail? u60.20 should be the standing charge (per 30 days) and u60.22 would be Tariff 2, if there is more than one rate?

Does the smart prepayment web page tell you what the tariff is? Maybe not the name or supplier, but at least the rates being charged?

stevelloyd71

I think the landlord is legit, I've seen screenshots of the EPC and 11 page lease, I'm 100 miles away so difficult to check other documentation.

She only moved in two months ago so no subsidy from last year.

U60.20 shows 2088, so £20.88 standing charge per 30 days?

U60.22 shows 80660, so 80.66p for a night rate?

Apparantely the management company for the block are in charge of the electric, not the landlord (the landlord doesn't own the whole block). She's asked the landlord to contact the management company and confirm the rates. But by those readings, it looks like £20.88 standing charge per 30 days and 80ish pence per kwh?

In your opinions, are those rates excessive and if so, excessive enough that the landlord should have pointed this out prior to lease signing etc. I've just come off a two year fix on my home electric to the standard variable, at 29.48 per kwh (50.31 p/day SC), so if the rates above are correct, the unit rate is getting close to triple the SVR.

She's on a 6 month fixed term lease and is hoping there's a way out, as the electric costs are going to be crippling once the cold weather arrives. I've never rented myself so have no experience of leases, but should the landlord not have disclosed electric rates to her prior to signing?

Like I said before, it's her first place, shes very 'green' to renting.

QrizB

stevelloyd71 said:

In your opinions, are those rates excessive and if so, excessive enough that the landlord should have pointed this out prior to lease signing etc.

IMHO that's excessive for a domestic contract but in the right ballpark for a commercial tariff that was taken out last winter.

If I was her landlord I like to think I'd have mentioned it but I don't think there's any obligation on the LL - they have stated they have no control over the electricity tariff, it's negotiated on behalf of the whole block by the management company. And we don't know when the tariff is next up for negotiation, or what the new rates might be.

How is the flat heated? If the property uses 5000kWh of electricity a year, that's £4.5k at the quoted tariff.

Right at the moment, hopefully she's using no more than 3-4kWh a day (do check this, take regular meter readings!) so ~£3 a day, £90 a month. But in winter she could get through 1000kWh in a month, almost £900.

Gerry1

Seems that the electric heaters will use daytime electricity which would be extremely expensive even at normal domestic rates.  If the rates shown on the meter are correct it'll be catastrophic.
Time to start looking for another property, preferably with gas central heating.

Spoonie_Turtle

Gerry1 said:

Time to start looking for another property, preferably with gas central heating.

OP says the tenant has a six-month fixed term contract.  Moving in two months ago presumably means she is stuck until at least December.

For the OP, do you know if she is able to break the contract with a financial penalty?  Although if the penalty is the full rent for those months, she probably really is stuck.  What's the position of her flat?  (Top floor/ground floor/north facing/sheltered by trees/etc.)  I wonder if she might get away with heated clothing instead of using heating in winter - decent ones can be expensive, but much less expensive than trying to heat the flat if those rates are correct. 
[And a heated throw/electric blanket would be helpful, of course.  I just know what it's like to live without decent heating and you need something to wear to not be miserable rather than just be in one place shrouded in a blanket not wanting to move or do anything.]

As a total lay person I'm appalled at the idea that a landlord might know the rates are high and not at all mention it, and appalled that it's not required information if you have no choice about tariffs.  It's certainly a lesson for anyone renting to enquire about energy rates before committing, just in case.

Gerry1

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Gerry1 said:

Time to start looking for another property, preferably with gas central heating.

OP says the tenant has a six-month fixed term contract.  Moving in two months ago presumably means she is stuck until at least December.

Agreed, but it may take some time to find something she likes and which is affordable and has appropriate heating.  With demand likely to exceed supply it may not be easy.

A good agent may be able to find a tenancy that's ending at the right time, so there's nothing to lose by starting to investigate now.

Scot_39

The landlord - is potentially in many respects - no different from an owner occupier in the block or tenant - with a tie to the freeholders commercial supply agreement - by the sounds of things.

They are not that uncommon - although - probably more have heard of them in the context of heat and hot water via community or block boiler heating systems.

There may have been clues in the rental agreement - about who supplies the property - or in the info given to the OP's relative re payment procedures.  

But to anyone unfamiliar - they would not be expecting the differences even paying a domestic supplied landlord can bring - let alone the potential large disparities between true commercial and domestic supply costs.

And for all the complaints about the govt and Ofgem / and energy suppliers - many of us were saving a fortune - not paying c50p /kWh electric from Oct, c67p from Jan (17p not 10.3p for gas etc) and again 50p from Apr etc - thanks to the EPG discounted rates - c33p ave.

The transition on normal domestic heating from those used to gas to standard rate electric - would be shock enough for many - but the rates quoted above take that to yet another level.

If flat well insulated - if het carefully / dare I say it minimally (at those rates), can make a massive difference to bills.

It would certainly be worth having a chat with relative about heating levels before those bills really start to grow in late autumn. And ways of minimising them before winter. 

Having a look at how controllable / configurable current heaters are (thermostats, timers etc).

Look at a few simple and cheap things - jumpers, leggings, slippers, or/and a throw for settee, an electric blanket to warm the bed before jump in at night etc can for many allow the thermostat to be tweaked down few degrees in some if not all rooms - and shave maybe several - possibly even 10s of percent off of bills in process.  

Things that many of the current generations have largely grown out of thinking about - due to decades of cheap gas central heating.

All commercial rates are likely to be reviewed periodically though - if very lucky - it may be before the worst of winter kicks in - so it might be worth asking the energy supplier when the next price revision is due - before panicking about considering moving again (talk of 6m tenancy agreements) etc.

stevelloyd71

Thank you for all the responses. Looks like looking for a new flat is the best course of action.