SIPP Performance

Albermarle

tony4147 said:

dunstonh said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following - 

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy

Pictet Water 1 dy

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

A bit of a bizarre selection.   A bunch of sustainable funds but then VLS60 included which is not sustainable.

In general, if you go ethical or ESG you expect lower returns over the long term.  If you have chosen to have an ESG position, then why would you include VLS60?     If you have not chosen to have an ESG position then why would your adviser look to handicap your portfolio with ESG funds?

I’m clueless on what ESG is etc that’s why I have an IFA. Most funds have an allocation of 7% apart from VLS60 which is 30%

ESG means Environmental, Social and Governance.
In plain English it means green/ethical funds.
Normally an IFA would only have so many ESG funds in a portfolio, if the client specifically requested them. 

tony4147

Albermarle said:

tony4147 said:

dunstonh said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following - 

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy

Pictet Water 1 dy

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

A bit of a bizarre selection.   A bunch of sustainable funds but then VLS60 included which is not sustainable.

In general, if you go ethical or ESG you expect lower returns over the long term.  If you have chosen to have an ESG position, then why would you include VLS60?     If you have not chosen to have an ESG position then why would your adviser look to handicap your portfolio with ESG funds?

I’m clueless on what ESG is etc that’s why I have an IFA. Most funds have an allocation of 7% apart from VLS60 which is 30%

ESG means Environmental, Social and Governance.
In plain English it means green/ethical funds.
Normally an IFA would only have so many ESG funds in a portfolio, if the client specifically requested them. 

I’ve not requested any funds, if I knew what funds to invest in I would do it myself, hence why I pay an IFA

Albermarle

tony4147 said:

Albermarle said:

tony4147 said:

dunstonh said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following - 

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy

Pictet Water 1 dy

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

A bit of a bizarre selection.   A bunch of sustainable funds but then VLS60 included which is not sustainable.

In general, if you go ethical or ESG you expect lower returns over the long term.  If you have chosen to have an ESG position, then why would you include VLS60?     If you have not chosen to have an ESG position then why would your adviser look to handicap your portfolio with ESG funds?

I’m clueless on what ESG is etc that’s why I have an IFA. Most funds have an allocation of 7% apart from VLS60 which is 30%

ESG means Environmental, Social and Governance.
In plain English it means green/ethical funds.
Normally an IFA would only have so many ESG funds in a portfolio, if the client specifically requested them. 

I’ve not requested any funds, if I knew what funds to invest in I would do it myself, hence why I pay an IFA

You do not specifically request any funds. The IFA should have explored your preferences, objectives etc .
Many people will say I do not want to invest in tobacco, armaments etc and the IFA will then pick funds along those lines.
If you never mentioned anything like that, it is strange that so many of your investments are ESG ones. 

dunstonh

tony4147 said:

Albermarle said:

tony4147 said:

dunstonh said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following - 

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy

Pictet Water 1 dy

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

A bit of a bizarre selection.   A bunch of sustainable funds but then VLS60 included which is not sustainable.

In general, if you go ethical or ESG you expect lower returns over the long term.  If you have chosen to have an ESG position, then why would you include VLS60?     If you have not chosen to have an ESG position then why would your adviser look to handicap your portfolio with ESG funds?

I’m clueless on what ESG is etc that’s why I have an IFA. Most funds have an allocation of 7% apart from VLS60 which is 30%

ESG means Environmental, Social and Governance.
In plain English it means green/ethical funds.
Normally an IFA would only have so many ESG funds in a portfolio, if the client specifically requested them. 

I’ve not requested any funds, if I knew what funds to invest in I would do it myself, hence why I pay an IFA

The IFA should be able to explain the portfolio strategy and the inclusion of every single fund in the portfolio.

You may also ask the question as to why you have so many ESG funds when you have not given them an ESG remit.   (unless your adviser firm has an ESG business model and ESG investing is their thing - but that would not explain VLS60 which is not ESG).    It is not uncommon for the odd ESG fund to appear in a non-ESG portfolio but that quantity takes a concerted effort.

Brilley

Hi OP, and many thanks for starting this thread as we ar in a similar position. We started with SJP many years ago, and to be fair we managed an overall return of around 5%, but then read all the reports about SJP so we changed FA. Since then we have averaged just over 1% over the last few years, (which I understand have been "difficult" years). 

The pain I am currently feeling is that we are now "losing" circa £500 per month compared to taking the money out and putting it in one of the better paying savings accounts. 

The dilemma is whether to carry on hoping that the markets will start to improve at some point, (why would they, unless the war in Ukraine suddenly ends?). (I accept it's 1st world problems compared to those poor souls on "the front line")

...I guess it's crystal ball time???

Bostonerimus1

OldScientist said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following -

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc    2.7%

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc     9.8%

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc             7.6%

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc       3.0%

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc        -0.9%

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc                                 1.9%

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc          -0.5%

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc          3.1%

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy                             11.6%

Pictet Water 1 dy                                                            8.3%

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc                                           2.1%

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

5 year annualised returns in bold (from various sources, mainly Trustnet and Fidelity). Have all/most of these been held (in various proportions) for the whole 5 years?

The ongoing charges with the funds are incorporated into the returns. You mention the IFA fee - are there platform or dealing charges as well?

We obviously need the allocation percentages and fee structure to see how the OP gets a 1% return over 5 years from this portfolio, but there seem to be only a few really poor performers. I think the OP needs to ask the IFA some stern questions. The question I always have when I see such portfolios is why include so many funds and why pay someone to "manage" it?

Bostonerimus1

tony4147 said:

Albermarle said:

tony4147 said:

dunstonh said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following - 

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy

Pictet Water 1 dy

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

A bit of a bizarre selection.   A bunch of sustainable funds but then VLS60 included which is not sustainable.

In general, if you go ethical or ESG you expect lower returns over the long term.  If you have chosen to have an ESG position, then why would you include VLS60?     If you have not chosen to have an ESG position then why would your adviser look to handicap your portfolio with ESG funds?

I’m clueless on what ESG is etc that’s why I have an IFA. Most funds have an allocation of 7% apart from VLS60 which is 30%

ESG means Environmental, Social and Governance.
In plain English it means green/ethical funds.
Normally an IFA would only have so many ESG funds in a portfolio, if the client specifically requested them. 

I’ve not requested any funds, if I knew what funds to invest in I would do it myself, hence why I pay an IFA

Multi-asset funds that hold a range of stocks and bonds were made just for the investor like you; your Vanguard Life Strategy 60% is an example of such a fund as it contains several tracker funds and gives you a pretty diverse portfolio just by owning it. There is no management required as it automatically rebalances and so an IFA isn't necessary. Does your IFA provide you with more than this portfolio and what have they done to manage the portfolio over the past 5 years. FYI on my simple tracker fund portfolio that has returned 8% annualized over the last 5 years I've done nothing. That's actually a valid strategy, but not one advertised by professional advisors.

OldScientist

Bostonerimus1 said:

OldScientist said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following -

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc    2.7%

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc     9.8%

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc             7.6%

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc       3.0%

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc        -0.9%

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc                                 1.9%

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc          -0.5%

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc          3.1%

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy                             11.6%

Pictet Water 1 dy                                                            8.3%

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc                                           2.1%

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

5 year annualised returns in bold (from various sources, mainly Trustnet and Fidelity). Have all/most of these been held (in various proportions) for the whole 5 years?

The ongoing charges with the funds are incorporated into the returns. You mention the IFA fee - are there platform or dealing charges as well?

We obviously need the allocation percentages and fee structure to see how the OP gets a 1% return over 5 years from this portfolio, but there seem to be only a few really poor performers. I think the OP needs to ask the IFA some stern questions. The question I always have when I see such portfolios is why include so many funds and why pay someone to "manage" it?

The OP said that each fund had a 7% allocation except for the Lifestrategy which was allocated 30%.

Taking the 5 years returns I'd found and posted earlier then the weighted portfolio return (assuming the same proportion of funds has been held for the last 5 years) would have been about 4.1% (I've used a weighted arithmetic average). Subtracting 0.7% for the IFA fee, this results in a return of 3.4% - still leaving a discrepancy of over 2 percentage points from the reported return of 1%.

So, the remaining questions are:
1) What are the platform fees?
2) Are there any transaction/load fees?

The platform fees will affect all of the investments, while the transaction fees will only have affected the purchases made in the last five years (unless there has been a lot of buying and selling in the account).

Albermarle

Brilley said:

Hi OP, and many thanks for starting this thread as we ar in a similar position. We started with SJP many years ago, and to be fair we managed an overall return of around 5%, but then read all the reports about SJP so we changed FA. Since then we have averaged just over 1% over the last few years, (which I understand have been "difficult" years). 

The pain I am currently feeling is that we are now "losing" circa £500 per month compared to taking the money out and putting it in one of the better paying savings accounts. 

The dilemma is whether to carry on hoping that the markets will start to improve at some point, (why would they, unless the war in Ukraine suddenly ends?). (I accept it's 1st world problems compared to those poor souls on "the front line")

...I guess it's crystal ball time???

Markets are affected by more than just one issue, Currently you could list a few, with the Ukraine war being just one of them.
Since the start of the Ukraine war the main US index has increased by 15%.

Bostonerimus1

OldScientist said:

Bostonerimus1 said:

OldScientist said:

tony4147 said:

The SIPP is made up of the following -

Abrdn Europe ex UK Ethical Equity Platform 1 Acc    2.7%

Janus Henderson Global Sustainable Equity 1Acc     9.8%

Royal London Sustainable World Trust C Acc             7.6%

Vanguard LifeStrategy 60% Equity A Shares Acc       3.0%

Sarasin Food & Agriculture Opportunities P Acc        -0.9%

CT Responsible UK Equity 2 Acc                                 1.9%

Liontrust Sustainable Future UK Growth 2 Acc          -0.5%

Janus HendersonUK Responsible Income 1 Inc          3.1%

Pictet Clean Energy Transition 1 dy                             11.6%

Pictet Water 1 dy                                                            8.3%

Trojan Ethical Income ) Acc                                           2.1%

IFA charges are 0.7% and then the fund charge

5 year annualised returns in bold (from various sources, mainly Trustnet and Fidelity). Have all/most of these been held (in various proportions) for the whole 5 years?

The ongoing charges with the funds are incorporated into the returns. You mention the IFA fee - are there platform or dealing charges as well?

We obviously need the allocation percentages and fee structure to see how the OP gets a 1% return over 5 years from this portfolio, but there seem to be only a few really poor performers. I think the OP needs to ask the IFA some stern questions. The question I always have when I see such portfolios is why include so many funds and why pay someone to "manage" it?

The OP said that each fund had a 7% allocation except for the Lifestrategy which was allocated 30%.

Taking the 5 years returns I'd found and posted earlier then the weighted portfolio return (assuming the same proportion of funds has been held for the last 5 years) would have been about 4.1% (I've used a weighted arithmetic average). Subtracting 0.7% for the IFA fee, this results in a return of 3.4% - still leaving a discrepancy of over 2 percentage points from the reported return of 1%.

So, the remaining questions are:
1) What are the platform fees?
2) Are there any transaction/load fees?

The platform fees will affect all of the investments, while the transaction fees will only have affected the purchases made in the last five years (unless there has been a lot of buying and selling in the account).

Exactly, if 1% is the annualized return where has the other 2.4% gone? I have my own thoughts about constructing a portfolio where the majority of funds have allocations under 10%, but the big issue here is what's happening to the bulk of the OP's returns?..if their numbers are correct.