Notifying Solicitor of Driver at Letter Before Claim Stage

Jimmi_78

Hi, I'm being chased for a Parking charge which I dispute. I was not the driver at the time, but never had opportunity to inform the Parking Company because they never sent a PCN (just started getting letters from their Debt Collector two months after the alleged breach of contract).

As this has now got to a Letter Before Claim stage, I want to know if the advice given in this old thread is still valid , in that I can ask the Solicitor to stop pursuing me if I provide them with the name and address of the driver at the time: 

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4754020/parking-letter-before-county-court-claim-lbccc-fight-back-guidance-thread/p1

There seems to be conflicting information online that I could only do this within a 28 day period of the NTK being served etc. but the thread above suggests that as long as they haven't started court action (which they haven't as I requested 30 day hold for debt advice) I can notify them at this LBC stage and have the process fully reset in the name of the actual driver?

A definitive answer (if it's out there) would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,

YankeeBrit

That's a 10-year-old thread! If you gave us a bit more useful information you could get up-to-date advice. Which PPC? Which solicitor?

Why do you want to throw the driver under the bus? Are you afraid to defend yourself as the RK?

You can provide the driver's details at any stage before a claim is issued. But why do you want to do that? What were the circumstances of the PCN?

Are the details on your V5C logbook up to date? Is that the reason you never heard anything until the debt collectors started harassing you? If they are not up to date, they could still try and get a default judgment by sending the claim to the old address on your V5C and you'd be none the wiser until you check your credit record or apply for some credit. You MUST contact the PPC and their solicitor and instruct them to "ERASE" your old address and to update their records with your current address. It matters not whether you updated your driver's licence. It is the V5C that counts.

Coupon-mad

There is a definitive answer.

But please stop reading that ANCIENT thread. It's not an Announcement thread, just an archive thing that's very out of date and you certainly don't reply using the old suggested LBC reply there about parts of the PAP that don't exist.

The BPA trade body took legal advice on how to interpret the POFA schedule 4 re when a transfer of liability could be invoked: 

http://portfolio.cpl.co.uk/Parking-News/395/26/

It's 'before action commences'.  At LBC stage it is pre-action so you can transfer liability now.

But if it's a family member, why would you?

And which PPC and legal firm sent the LBC?

Jimmi_78

Thanks for the replies, much appreciated. I wish I had joined the forum earlier to ask for help, but I expect that's the first thing almost every newbie says. 

It's DCBL who are chasing on behalf Highview(now Group Nexus). My husband parked in a fairly poorly signed area of a car park which is reserved for permit holders. It's one of those scenarios where you can park for free for 90mins in one area of the car park, but permit only in another area. He parked in the permit area for approx 20 mins, thinking he was in a 'free' area. The bays aren't specifically marked and the signage is confusing as to the specific area they are referring to. 

Two months after parking there, I started getting letters from Debt Collectors demanding £170 (I'm the RK). We immediately wrote back stating we never received any PCN/NTK so we were not liable for anything and demanded they remove us from their database. They kept sending their notices, so we asked for a copy of whatever PCN they held because my husband was confident he'd only been in the car park for a very short time and was bemused because of 90mins free parking that is available in the 'free' section of the car park and signed on the only entrance/exit to the car park.

The copy of the PCN they eventually sent us was a mess, entire sections not printed and all over the place, no information on how to appeal, how to notify of driver etc. I did a bit of research on here and it was clear the PCN was invalid, so I sent an analysis back to them, stating that this was probably the reason why the PCN and reminder was never sent from Highview, as it wasn't being rendered correctly in printed format.

 A few weeks later they email me back and state the copy of the PCN they sent me was incorrect due to a "download error" on their systems. They attached a corrected / repaired version of the PCN (this is now four months after the alleged infringement).

We continued to play email tennis, I repeatedly pointed out that we had never received the PCN according to the proper process. Eventually we get a standard letter from the Debt Collector stating that we had "not replied" to any of their correspondence and they were now passing the case to the solicitor!

We now have received the LBC from DCBL legal. I have replied asking for the 30 day Debt Advice hold while I research more. I also offered, without prejudice, to re-engage with the Parking Company only if they fully reset their process, allowing me to appeal, notify the driver, and allow me to consider whether to just pay the standard £50 I could have paid had I received a PCN from the Parking Company. 

They immediately wrote back (day after), basically stating they would not accept this and that I would have had the opportunity to appeal when the original PCNs were issued, but that time frame has now expired blah blah blah. 

So I now want to inform them of the Driver, to force them to reset the process. My husband can then decide whether to follow the process through to the courts or just settle at the discounted amount.

I suspect they may reject my request for them to pursue the driver instead of me, ( I think they just blindly want to follow a single path) ... if that happens, and in view of what you have confirmed here I then have absolutely solid evidence to dispute all charges, and claim back for self litigation etc.

Thanks,

YankeeBrit

This is easily defended without throwing the driver under the bus. They will not "reset" anything. You are dealing with an intellectually malnourished company, DCB Legal.

Was the original PCN PoFA compliant? If you're not sure, post a picture (both sides) of the PCN with just the PCN number, your name, address and the VRN of the car redacted. Keep the dates showing as that is also important.

You should never, ever, contact or communicate with the debt collectors. They are powerless and are not a party to the contract your husband allegedly breached. All you had to do was send an SAR to Highview.

Coupon-mad

It wasn't POFA compliant because Group Nexus only started issuing POFA NTKs in 2023.

Therefore, the last thing a keeper (who can't be held legally liable by Highview aka Group Nexus) should consider doing is throwing the person under the bus who COULD be held liable!

You have a bullet proof defence!

The driver doesn't.  DON'T DO IT!

You are right, if you'd come here when you got the PCN you'd have had it cancelled with ONE template email appeal from yourself as keeper telling them you weren't driving and to go swivel!

No POPLA, no Court, no stress, nothing! 

Still, defending a DCB Legal claim is easy (we have a Template Defence) and you won't even have a hearing.  

Jimmi_78

OK, so informing the Solicitor of the Driver won't reset the claim? Won't Group Nexus be required to send a PCN to the Driver with right of appeal via POPLA etc?

Coupon-mad

Nope.

They don't have to (yet...things will be different under the new statutory regime in 2024) and - this is the bottom line - why would you do that when the driver could easily then lose at POPLA?

You (keeper) CAN'T LOSE in defending this case.

Jimmi_78

Right OK, this isn't good news! Unfortunately I already sent the details off in an email response. I was under the impression the Driver would have to be afforded the same rights as the Keeper once notified. That's my misinterpretation. What is likely to happen next? The Solicitor will send an LBC direct to the Driver, is there no right of appeal at all for the Driver? 

KeithP

Jimmi_78 said:

Right OK, this isn't good news! Unfortunately I already sent the details off in an email response. I was under the impression the Driver would have to be afforded the same rights as the Keeper once notified. That's my misinterpretation. What is likely to happen next? The Solicitor will send an LBC direct to the Driver, is there no right of appeal at all for the Driver? 

Crazy!!

You started this thread at 1:13pm this afternoon asking if you should reveal the driver's identity.

Two people - @YankeeBrit and @Coupon-mad - have both told you more than once in no uncertain terms that you would be unwise to give the driver's details to the parking company.

Yet the next thing you write is (effectively) "I decided not to take any notice of your responses".

Jimmi_78

I do apologise, I just began by asking a question!

 The truth is with the amount of conflicting opinions and advice on the internet, it's highly confusing and stressful for newbies. I've been researching all morning (now all day) and to be honest just wanted to defer the process as simply as possible for another few months so I could enjoy my holiday which is imminent and then pick up again later in the year.

It's my husband who is being thrown under the bus! ... so whatever the outcome it's our collective household that is taking the brunt. My husband was driving the car so we also felt if it did reach court he could better argue the case of inadequate signage without us both losing a days work.

I'd already composed my reply to the Solicitor before asking the question, and I was just looking to validate given the age of the post.

I'm being attacked enough already by Solicitors and Debt Collectors. Just looking for support!