Executor/beneficiary has ignored will

Sea_Shell

Have you any idea of the rough £££ involved here?

If it "goes legal" it could get expensive, so what is your 1/4 potentially worth?

Do you have a good relationship with your cousins, so they could come on board, or are they firmly on their mum's (?) side.

Keep_pedalling

Sea_Shell said:

Have you any idea of the rough £££ involved here?

If it "goes legal" it could get expensive, so what is your 1/4 potentially worth?

Do you have a good relationship with your cousins, so they could come on board, or are they firmly on their mum's (?) side.

Hopefully legal costs should not be an issue as the OP has legal cover with their home insurance and there would appear to be 2 cases of criminal fraud that have taken place. 

Sounds like the cousins are the aunt’s children who may not be so keen to take action against their mother especially as they stand to eventually benefit from her fraud. 

Jay199555

Keep_pedalling said:

Sea_Shell said:

Have you any idea of the rough £££ involved here?

If it "goes legal" it could get expensive, so what is your 1/4 potentially worth?

Do you have a good relationship with your cousins, so they could come on board, or are they firmly on their mum's (?) side.

Hopefully legal costs should not be an issue as the OP has legal cover with their home insurance and there would appear to be 2 cases of criminal fraud that have taken place. 

Sounds like the cousins are the aunt’s children who may not be so keen to take action against their mother especially as they stand to eventually benefit from her fraud. 

I'm not entirely sure but I believe around the £80-90k mark. I'm also not sure if my aunt would need to pay interest on what is owed given the time passed? But like Keep pedalling said, I'm hoping the home insurance can cover it. 

I've not spoken to that side of the family since my nan's death, I believe they lost touch with me as my aunt was attempting to cover up the will. The cousins aren't my aunt's children, but 1 cousin does live within the property with the aunt in question. I could see them wanting their share once I've started the process.

Savvy_Sue

Possibly worth checking with your cousins? They may not want to rock the boat, but ... 

Agree with the 'go straight to legal advice'! 

Land_Registry

Sea_Shell said:

Giving this some more thought...

How was she allowed (able) to put the property in her sole name, if probate showed that the estate was to be split 4 ways?

Are there no checks and balances at Land Registry's end?

@Land_Registry can you assist?   How does it all work?

OP, have you checked on LR to see what it says.  You can get a copy for £3 I believe.

Some basics first - we register the legal ownership of land and property. We don’t register wills or deal with a deceased’s estate 
Nan it appears owned the property alone so when she died it formed part of her estate along with her monies, belongings etc. 
Probate was therefore needed to deal with her estate and executor(s) appointed. The executor(s) then deal with the estate inc property according to her will. 

The law protects proven beneficiaries. Not HMLR as we deal with the land plus bricks & mortar as a whole. The quarter share for example is in the beneficial ownership, the value of the land plus bricks & mortar. The £s and pence realised for example when a property is sold. 

Now Auntie, as executor, has transferred the legal ownership into her name plus husband. That can happen if the estates been dealt with and her share equated to say the property value. 

To repeat we register the legal ownership so don’t police the estate shares so no fraud here. And no mortgage fraud as if she’s mortgaged it as the registered legal owner then no mortgage fraud either. 

So going back to OP’s original Qs then yes you may have a claim and a legal challenge re your beneficial share but you’ve got to prove it and that starts with Nan’s will. 

The complexities that followed re her mental health and actions of Auntie and other beneficiaries are likely to impact also re any legal challenge. But your solicitor needs to advise you and if the evidence exists to back up your legal claim they can also advise re best options and next steps. 

None of that impacts on the registered title unless it has to be sold for example. 

Hope that helps explain our role at least 

AMILLIONDOLLARS

As all have said, she is in a lot of trouble. An official letter of impending litigation from a Solicitor, will have her scrambling to put matters right. As it stands, both she and her husband are liable, the fact that his name is now on the deeds makes him an accomplice, he cannot argue that he did not know what his wife was doing.

The Law Society has a list of specialist lawyers that you will be able to contact, if your house insurance policy does not cover you.  A few hundred pounds for a consultation would be money well spent.

Good luck

RAS

Try checking out Mera (Ali) v WaterAid. The former got 70% of the estate and the latter 30%. Mr Meta is the executor and hasn't paid WaterAid. Also bought the primary residence from the estate at a massive undervalue.

Been removed as executor, has £50k+ legal fees to pay and faces losing the properties.

Sea_Shell

Land_Registry said:

Sea_Shell said:

Giving this some more thought...

How was she allowed (able) to put the property in her sole name, if probate showed that the estate was to be split 4 ways?

Are there no checks and balances at Land Registry's end?

@Land_Registry can you assist?   How does it all work?

OP, have you checked on LR to see what it says.  You can get a copy for £3 I believe.

Some basics first - we register the legal ownership of land and property. We don’t register wills or deal with a deceased’s estate 
Nan it appears owned the property alone so when she died it formed part of her estate along with her monies, belongings etc. 
Probate was therefore needed to deal with her estate and executor(s) appointed. The executor(s) then deal with the estate inc property according to her will. 

The law protects proven beneficiaries. Not HMLR as we deal with the land plus bricks & mortar as a whole. The quarter share for example is in the beneficial ownership, the value of the land plus bricks & mortar. The £s and pence realised for example when a property is sold. 

Now Auntie, as executor, has transferred the legal ownership into her name plus husband. That can happen if the estates been dealt with and her share equated to say the property value. 

To repeat we register the legal ownership so don’t police the estate shares so no fraud here. And no mortgage fraud as if she’s mortgaged it as the registered legal owner then no mortgage fraud either. 

So going back to OP’s original Qs then yes you may have a claim and a legal challenge re your beneficial share but you’ve got to prove it and that starts with Nan’s will. 

The complexities that followed re her mental health and actions of Auntie and other beneficiaries are likely to impact also re any legal challenge. But your solicitor needs to advise you and if the evidence exists to back up your legal claim they can also advise re best options and next steps. 

None of that impacts on the registered title unless it has to be sold for example. 

Hope that helps explain our role at least 

Thanks for that comprehensive reply.   

I think I understand.    Basically at LR, you have no input as to HOW the estate is supposed to be distributed, and even if the will says X, then that could always have been dealt with by either a Deed of Variation, or a buyout (where more cash in exchange for property) is agreed between beneficiaries. 

LR would not be party to any such agreements, and so is not their 'business' as it were.    They just act on executors instructions. 



How are you getting on @Jay199555

Flugelhorn

When did she take ownership of the property? I am just wondering if the property was in fact out in her name, perhaps jointly with Nan, before Nan died and hence became solely hers after the death? Is there a date for the change?

Jay199555

That makes more sense from a land registry perspective. She took ownership in 2017, probate was given in 2016.

I’m currently waiting to hear back about my claim via my home insurance, should hear back in a couple days. But have discussed this with a solicitor who said I’m definitely in the right. Thinking I’ll just go through a solicitor as likely quicker. So either way will be proceeding forwards next week.

thanks again for the advice everyone! This has been extremely helpful.