Supplier still wont put gas in my name

bwolf99

Hi everyone

This is probably strange one.

We moved in to a rental 9 months ago, the supplier here wrote to me immediately and we started paying the electricity.

A couple of months passed and still no gas bill, I contacted the agent who confirmed the supplier was the same as the electricity and that they had informed them we had moved in, they didn't seem too bothered we weren't paying gas yet.

I contacted the supplier via email to ask why we hadnt been getting bills and I got a reply saying they had no record of us, I replied well I am paying you for electricity, a few emails later they asked for a copy of my tenancy agreement, which I emailed them,then  silence their end...

Emailed them a few times since then asking for an update and just get nothing back at all, a meter reader came here asking to read the meters based on the landlord living here , when I told him the landlord moved out 8 years ago he said he wouldnt come in and that this company are known for being an absolute sh.t show and to make sure all correspondence is in writing.

I havent heard back from them and gave up emailing them about 3 months ago but they are sending me electricity bills here still which I am paying, and I assume gas bills to the landlord as I dropped the first couple back in to the estate agents but now I just put them back in the letterbox return to sender.

Where do I stand with all this ? I tried to tell them I live here, have chased them 4 or 5 times in writing and nothing, will they still be able to charge me for this years gas once they work out what they are doing?

I have all the emails supplying them with proof I live here and also me chasing them up

CSI_Yorkshire

walshy99 said:

will they still be able to charge me for this years gas once they work out what they are doing?

Yes.  Under almost every circumstance, regardless of any fault, they will be able to charge you for a year's gas.

bwolf99

CSI_Yorkshire said:

walshy99 said:

will they still be able to charge me for this years gas once they work out what they are doing?

Yes.  Under almost every circumstance, regardless of any fault, they will be able to charge you for a year's gas.

Doesent really seem fair tbh, they are just ignoring me but I thought as much.
They arent much better on the elctrcity side of things either to be honest
Not really sure what to do then as it looks like there will be a large bill coming my way sooner or later

CSI_Yorkshire

If you haven't paid gas for a year, and you knew you weren't paying, you should have a nice pot built up ready to pay it?

QrizB

Have you considered switching supplier?

molerat

Which supplier ?

Have you checked the national register to see who is actually supplying the property ?  Don't take what the agent says as the truth.  Someone I know moved into a property where the gas "was with the same as the electric and was prepayment".  Gas was in fact shipperless and a normal antique meter was fitted.

https://www.findmysupplier.energy/

Scot_39

Yes.  Awkward.

I am defintely no expert on your rights - but I suspect they can and will eventually bill you.

I believe there are databases on which you can check supplier details by property - but as you say have seen the landlord bills -  guess you know those are same supplier you were told by agents ?

Certainly once registered they can correct billing for previous years - and charge in full for a 12 month period under back billing rules.  Edit : and possibly beyond if you were deemed at fault by not registering properly with correct supplier.

You are using the fuel,  you think should be paying, so assume that's the legal terms of your rental.

Your landlord and/or agent would normally be fully protected by normal tenancy agreement clauses once you moved in if so. One simple reason the agent wouldn't be bothered - it's not their legal responsibilty or cost - but yours as tennant.  Edit 2  - and the second they already have yours and landlords fee money - often for little effort.
And forget the 8 years since resident thing, the landlord may well simply have taken over supplies in his name between tennants - a normal scenario when even a small gap.

Sounds like more than a simple admin error at firm after 9 months though.

Sadly many suplliers have been overpowered in last 9 months with SofLR acquisitions of 100,000s of new customers, EBSS and EPG billing issues, debt etc etc.

A couple of my own calls and follow up emails on a couple of far far more minor issues - have understandably gone unanswered quickly. 1 of them for months - for an error spotted and initially reported 1st week of Apr -  was fixed just last week - c3.5 months.

EOnNext my supplier was recently fined for poor service last autumn iirc.  Others at least had wrists smacked i.e. formal warnings from Ofgem.

And ignoring such a major issue for 3 months - whilst I can understand the inclination / frustration - is really not the correct approach - and makes any claim you are even morally in the right - now a tad difficult to justify.

You should have contacted customer services by phone if emails unanswered, escalated to formal complaint if / when unresolved in a timely fashion, and then if that complaint not resolved in 8 weeks, taken to Ombudsman.

Make sure you keep a hold of your day 1 readings.

And I would start putting aside money for the gas bill when it comes - which I hope you have been for last 9 months over winters high use.

bwolf99

QrizB said:

Have you considered switching supplier?

That was another mess, I did and it only allowed me to switch electricity only ! Lol, so I just cancelled the switch, that was a whole mess as when I cancelled the switch Octopus still took it, so I made a complaint and eventually EDF took the electricity back.

At the same time I complained to the same email address in a separate email about the gas again and they ignored it  while replying to the electricity email, its weird they only reply to emails about electric and not gas

I have the money to pay when the bill eventually comes but I am guessing they would offer a payment plan.

I dont see why I should call them, they asked me to send a tennancy agreement by email, I did and they just ignored me, and have ignored several emails since !

Not sure what my next step is, I know there is going to be a big bill coming, I suppose I hoped as they had messed up they couldnt charge me, someone said once it goes over 12 months its harder for them to charge?

bwolf99

Scot_39 said:

Yes.  Awkward.

I am defintely no expert on your rights - but I suspect they can and will eventually bill you.

I believe there are databases on which you can check supplier details by property - but as you say have seen the landlord bills -  guess you know those are same supplier you were told by agents ?

Certainly once registered they can correct billing for previous years - and charge in full for a 12 month period under back billing rules.  Edit : and possibly beyond if you were deemed at fault by not registering properly with correct supplier.

You are using the fuel,  you think should be paying, so assume that's the legal terms of your rental.

Your landlord and/or agent would normally be fully protected by normal tenancy agreement clauses once you moved in if so. One simple reason the agent wouldn't be bothered - it's not their legal responsibilty or cost - but yours as tennant.  Edit 2  - and the second they already have yours and landlords fee money - often for little effort.
And forget the 8 years since resident thing, the landlord may well simply have taken over supplies in his name between tennants - a normal scenario when even a small gap.

Sounds like more than a simple admin error at firm after 9 months though.

Sadly many suplliers have been overpowered in last 9 months with SofLR acquisitions of 100,000s of new customers, EBSS and EPG billing issues, debt etc etc.

A couple of my own calls and follow up emails on a couple of far far more minor issues - have understandably gone unanswered quickly. 1 of them for months - for an error spotted and initially reported 1st week of Apr -  was fixed just last week - c3.5 months.

EOnNext my supplier was recently fined for poor service last autumn iirc.  Others at least had wrists smacked i.e. formal warnings from Ofgem.

And ignoring such a major issue for 3 months - whilst I can understand the inclination / frustration - is really not the correct approach - and makes any claim you are even morally in the right - now a tad difficult to justify.

You should have contacted customer services by phone if emails unanswered, escalated to formal complaint if / when unresolved in a timely fashion, and then if that complaint not resolved in 8 weeks, taken to Ombudsman.

Make sure you keep a hold of your day 1 readings.

And I would start putting aside money for the gas bill when it comes - which I hope you have been for last 9 months over winters high use.

I did think about the ombudsman, what will this do though?

BobT36

bwolf99 said:

QrizB said:

Have you considered switching supplier?

Someone said once it goes over 12 months its harder for them to charge?

Harder (but not impossible) for them to charge OVER 12 months. But they can certainly charge up to 12 months, so keep a year's worth of gas bill money handy.. 

Scot_39

1) You need to be in a formal complaint situation that has not been resolved for 8 weeks or rejected (with a formal deadlock letter from supplier) - the real supplier not just the agents named supplier - but with the actual deemed contract supplier - in your case for gas supply at time of moving in - before going to the Ombudsman.

They are not a consumer champion - they are there to look at hard facts only - and those provided by both supplier and customer.

If they agree you owe the money under strict legal terms - you owe the money - and they are as likely to back the firm - as back you - especially after 9m or so - depending on who they blame for not resolving.

And I hate to say it - to me - 3+ months of waiting passively for a response - given the potential seriousness - might not sit well.

2)  So again - just to clarify

Were / and are - the landlord's gas bills that you have been returning from the same company ?

Did you use the database search link above ?

Who did the meter company name as your landlords gas supplier when asked to read gas meter but in landlords name ?

Do they all agree ?

PS When was that meter reading - because that visit would have been registered with supplier as a failure to read - and could itself set other balls in motion.

3)  Did you contact you landlord or agents informing them that those bills have been arriving and you still aren't able to take over supply as EDF? still refuse to do so ?  

Are you worried about doing so ?

4) Strictly speaking - I suspect any letters to your landlord should be forwarded to your landlord - not returned. 

As still the property owner - and responsible still for many services needed at that property - gas and electric safety certificates, buildings insurance, factors - oops - freeholder where relevant - bills / comms etc - even whilst occupied.

Most of those would normally go direct in many cases - but not always.

And as my original post - landlords frequently do take over utility contracts / payments between tenants

This is NOT the same as your legal duty to return mail sent to an unknown addressee.

And going via agents - well I have a low trust level with them - from past experiences in younger life.

5) What may well have started as a simple admin error - will be by now a decent outstanding gas bill.

You may be lucky if it was EDF and they decide to write off the past 9 months - due to their error - but I suspect that would be very lucky given circumstances. 

If EDF were the day 1 registered - your deemed contract supplier on moving in - for gas - and they have actually wrongly administered your request to take over the supply - I suspect you should first escalate as a formal complaint with them - if not done so already - by email and phone to register sent. But if you had - you should really have been in contact - by phone if not responding to emails etc - to check progress - especially so far in.

But you need to know that for sure. So please use the link above as well.

Are you still getting gas bills in landlords name - initially it may have provided conclusive evidence EDF were wrong not to accept you for gas as well as electric from day 1 as (and if*) requested.  And if not EDF - told you who you needed to / now need to contact. (*)Assuming your request was clear to register for both fuels. 

But note I am not suggesting you read any future bills yourself - as legally you cannot simply and deliberately open landlords post.

If it turns out your landlord - has been accidentally paying - with luck and goodwill you might be able to agree to pay cash plus say a token loss of interest - as you indicate you have the cash - and register from an agreed date - as a very informal solution (if LL agrees).

Arguably he should have checked but as you say the agents claimed to have notified the supplier on his behalf - but if their paperwork was wrong - that would also only have applied to electric.  I'll leave you to decide whether thats fair or you think landlord should chase agents instead. I tend to take the simplistic view - if used the gas - pay for it - and it's maybe better to keep a good landlord on side if can - in today's rental market. But as I say below - it may be worth taking some actual experienced advice on this and other issues.

Worst case - there are debts potentially accumulating in your landlords name and debt recovery mechanisms working away in the background. And that could have negative consequences for both landlord and you - depending on how it evolves / resolves - but time is definitely not on your side after 9 months plus to minimize those risks.

As I said above I can understand the frustration. But you need to take your contractual obligations as an adult seriously - and put such frustrations to the side - and just deal with things.

So between you - the true deemed contract supplier if or if not EDF for gas - and sadly after so long potentially your landlord - it needs to be resolved quickly - not simply ignored for even longer.

I would start by confirming supplier - independently for gas - and phoning as soon as possible - either way. 

I am no expert - but from a personal perspective, I can see things that just don't sit right - going on here - between EDF/you, potentially you/your landlord etc.

And it might be best to try and talk to someone with real experience - say at citizens advice or a tennants / energy support charity - on some of these issues.

Starting now - or early next week at latest - if need time to gather the history in a clear and factual - not emotive - summary.