Napier Parking / BW Legal

powerbarge

Summary of issue:

My car was parked in a car park in December 2022 using a 30 mins free ticket
Returned to car after 43 mins due to being held up and exited the car park

I never received any notices in the post from the car park operator, I moved house around this time, but recently began receiving mail from BW Legal about legal action, which I ignored
Recently I received a county court N1 claim form for the following:

Amount claimed £163.90
Court fee £35
Legal rep. costs £50
Total £248.90

I plan to use the template defence, something like UKPC court claim - Page 3 — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Is it the opinion of those here that this enough? Surely this enormous cost is not justified

Thanks in advance

Le_Kirk

If you moved address, did you update your V5C; this is the normal reason for people not receiving the original PCN/NTK.  You can use the template defence or the @Johny86 defence depending upon whether the Particulars of Claim are detailed or not.  Whichever defence you use, what are you going to put in paragraphs 2 & 3.

KeithP

powerbarge said:

Recently I received a county court N1 claim form...

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

powerbarge

Issue date 16th June 2023

I think I was a bit late updating my V5 but I can't recall for sure, there are so many things to do when you move it's easy for something to slip through the cracks

I think today I should do the AoS?

I will draft something for those paragraphs 

KeithP

powerbarge said:

Issue date 16th June 2023

I think today I should do the AoS?

With a Claim Issue Date of 16th June, you have until Wednesday 5th July to file an Acknowledgment of Service but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an Acknowledgment of Service, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Wednesday 19th July 2023 to file your Defence.

That's almost four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service guidance.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.

powerbarge said:

I think I was a bit late updating my V5 but I can't recall for sure...

Look at the vehicle's Registration Document (V5c).

Look for the Doc Ref number. There is a date following it.

On my V5c it's at the bottom of the second page in a box headed "Official use only. Do not write in this space".

The first line format is an eleven digit Document Reference Number followed by a dd mm yy date.

That is the date that your V5c was last updated.

powerbarge

AoS filed as per instructions, thanks for that

Re V5C - I can't check that as i've subsequently sold the car since then

Defence - I have drafted as follows (rest is the typical template) - does anyone have any advice for wording around "Frustration of Contract"?

3. The Driver dispensed a “free” 30 minutes parking ticket from the automated machine at <CAR PARK ADDRESS> and displayed this on the vehicle’s dashboard. After being delayed due to a long queue for a public toilet while shopping, due to the time of year (In December, one of the busiest periods for shopping areas), The Driver returned to the vehicle and promptly exited the car park, but unbeknownst to them, they had overstayed by a mere 13 minutes. The late exit of the Defendant’s vehicle from the car park was due to circumstances beyond the Driver's control, and as such constitutes frustration of contract.

4. Due to a change of address, the Defendant did not receive any correspondence regarding the alleged breach of contract until legal proceedings were underway, approximately 6 months after the alleged contractual breach, and therefore was not able to raise an appeal utilising the normal channels.

Thanks for all you do on here so far, it's much appreciated.

(I need to go and check the signs at the car park again but I reckon they're pretty watertight)

Coupon-mad

'The Driver': no. The Defendant because it was you!

And absolurely NO ADMISSIONS LIKE THIS:

 "they had overstayed by a mere 13 minutes." 

You had NOT overstayed your parking time.  You should be talking about fair consideration and grace periods such as those set out by the Government in the new (stalled but soon resurrected and incoming) DLUHC Code of Practice which makes it clear that BOTH periods apply.

IIRC (because I was involved as I was on the Steering Group for this new Code) It also states that a period of parking is not the period captured by ANPR.  Summat like that.

Go Google it!  And don't come back and tell me it's 'withdrawn' and and query if it applies (please!).  Of course it does and will be back on course by the time you get a hearing.

powerbarge

Thanks, will update as such

I found the following in the code you referenced, it says there is a minimum consideration period 5 mins, and a grace period of 10 mins, so taking full advantage of those two times, the total time (43 mins) is less than the free period + permitted grace period and permitted consideration period (45 mins)

However, it also states "It is important to stress that the consideration period is the amount of time a driver has to decide whether or not to park, including the time needed to find an available parking space.Should the driver decide to do so within the consideration period, e.g. by purchasing a pay-and-display tariff ticket in less than 5 minutes, or if there is evidence that the driver has left the location e.g. by observation by an attendant, the consideration period is deemed to have expired, other than for pay-on-exit premises."

In this particular car park, you have to enter your reg and press a button to get the free ticket. The times stated on the notice are arrival and departure times (accompanied by ANPR photos), NOT the time when the ticket was dispensed.

They should have to prove that I dispensed the ticket less than 5 minutes after entering the car park to shorten the consideration period, right? 

powerbarge

Also

2.24 parking period

the length of time that a vehicle has been parked, i.e. left stationary otherwise than in the course of driving, after any relevant consideration period has expired (excluding instances where the driver has stopped to enable passengers to leave or enter the vehicle)

This is not the period between a vehicle being recorded as entering and departing controlled land.

Coupon-mad

Yep, and:

5. Duration of parking period

As a matter of contract law, drivers need to be given an appropriate opportunity to understand and decide whether to accept the terms and conditions that apply should they choose to park a vehicle on controlled land. In pay-and-display premises, drivers need to have time to make the requisite payment before a parking period commences for the purpose of calculating the time a vehicle is parked in relation to the tariff payable. The amount of time needed varies according to the nature and size of the premises, and in car parks open to the public includes the time needed to find and access a vacant parking bay, or to leave the premises should the driver decide not to park, hence the need for a consideration period before the contract between the driver and the parking operator is made and the parking period occurs. It is also a requirement to allow a grace period at the end of the parking period where parking is permitted.

5.1 Consideration period

The parking operator must allow a consideration period of appropriate duration, subject to the requirements set out at Annex B, taking the following factors into account:

a) the time required for a driver to identify and access a parking bay appropriate to their needs;

1. For example, a driver seeking a Blue Badge parking bay or a parent and child parking bay, waiting for another vehicle to vacate a bay, returning to the vehicle to check the VRM, queuing at a payment machine, etc.

b)the time required for a driver to identify and read signs that display the parking terms and conditions, or the consequences of choosing to park where public parking is not invited;

c) the time required for a driver to identify and comply with requirements for payment;

2. This is particularly important for controlled land where the requirement is to pay and display a permit using on-site machinery, make an exact payment in cash using specific coins, or pay-by-phone or online through a process that could take several minutes.

Umkomaas

In this particular car park, you have to enter your reg and press a button to get the free ticket. The times stated on the notice are arrival and departure times (accompanied by ANPR photos), NOT the time when the ticket was dispensed. 

In which case, you need to read this Court judgment. It was from the Court of Appeal and the decision from it is persuasive for all lower courts, should your case get that far.
 

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2019/854.html